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New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:18 am
by SXDFC
Hello All:

Upon reading and looking at the pictures of the UA upgrades thread, I came across the pictures of the new UA LTRTL lights. I also noticed that this replaced the nose gear lights as well. Does anyone know if they replaced the retractable landing lights too? Lastly does anyone have a picture with them lit and if there is any differences to it compared to the older 737 lights?

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:31 am
by yeelep
Yes, the retractable landing lights are also gone.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:19 pm
by barney captain
I posted this under the First MAX Power on thread for just a bit more info -


A few other changes we've been made aware of that will also be incorporated into future -800 NGs-

A complete redesign of the external lighting system that eliminates the taxi light as well as the fuselage mounted retractable landing lights. You can see those switches are missing in the OPs pic. The new LED LTRTL System (LED Landing, Taxi and Runway Turnoff Lights) is said to provide better lighting as well as save weight and mx costs.

While the taxi light switch remains, it's function has completely changed. With the removal of the nose gear mounted taxi light, activation of the switch now turns on the wing root mounted LED landing lights - but at a reduced power setting. Activation of the landing light switches returns them to full power. Other than being replaced with LEDs, the turn off lights appear to be unchanged.

These seem like good improvements as the lone taxi light frequently provided inadequate illumination. Also it's location subjected it to a lot of vibration leading to early failure. The removal of the retractable landing lights will illiminate the issues of FOD damage from runways contaminated with ice and snow.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:02 pm
by SXDFC
Is this an option or is this going to be standard on all new 737s?

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:55 pm
by barney captain
Quoting SXDFC (Reply 3):
Is this an option or is this going to be standard on all new 737s?

My guess is that this will be the new standard. I know there is a new pedestal coming out as well that will match the MAX.

I wonder if the UA a/c in the pic's has that it.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:43 pm
by PGNCS
Quoting barney captain (Reply 2):
While the taxi light switch remains, it's function has completely changed. With the removal of the nose gear mounted taxi light, activation of the switch now turns on the wing root mounted LED landing lights - but at a reduced power setting. Activation of the landing light switches returns them to full power. Other than being replaced with LEDs, the turn off lights appear to be unchanged.

These seem like good improvements as the lone taxi light frequently provided inadequate illumination. Also it's location subjected it to a lot of vibration leading to early failure.

Interesting stuff. This sounds like a definite improvement as I often found the 737 exterior illumination (and especially the taxi light) feeble compared to other types.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 1:03 am
by AAR90
Quoting PGNCS (Reply 5):
Interesting stuff. This sounds like a definite improvement as I often found the 737 exterior illumination (and especially the taxi light) feeble compared to other types.

AA's newer 738's have the LED taxi light (even had one on an older plane last trip) and it is a very noticeable improvement from the cockpit.  

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:31 am
by PGNCS
Quoting AAR90 (Reply 6):
Quoting PGNCS (Reply 5):Interesting stuff. This sounds like a definite improvement as I often found the 737 exterior illumination (and especially the taxi light) feeble compared to other types.
AA's newer 738's have the LED taxi light (even had one on an older plane last trip) and it is a very noticeable improvement from the cockpit.

Hey, thanks for the report! As soon as I heard about that I was curious how much better it was than the old dim bulb system. Sounds like a great update.  

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:54 am
by barney captain
Quoting AAR90 (Reply 6):
AA's newer 738's have the LED taxi light (even had one on an older plane last trip) and it is a very noticeable improvement from the cockpit.  

AA-

Was this the new design (elimination of the taxi light) or a relamp of the existing taxi light to LED?

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 4:12 am
by SXDFC
Quoting AAR90 (Reply 6):

So this can be a retrofit too? Is there a component that can fill in the retractable lights too?

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 1:49 pm
by Western727
Quoting SXDFC (Reply 3):
Is this an option or is this going to be standard on all new 737s?

Standard on all 737s LN #5555 and up.

Quoting barney captain (Reply 8):
Was this the new design (elimination of the taxi light) or a relamp of the existing taxi light to LED?

I'm curious about this one too.

Separate question: will the red anticollision strobes get changed to LEDs from LN #5555 and up, too? I think it'd look a bit funny if the LTRTL and white wingtip flashers are all LED while the red fuselage lights stay strobes.

ETA: what about the aft fuselage white flasher? I believe it has remained a strobe while the wingtip flashers got changed to LEDs in the past year or so. Why the "odd one out"?

[Edited 2015-11-19 05:52:36]

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 4:08 pm
by Dogbreath
Here's a couple of pictures that were taken during the certification testing of the LTRTL in Seattle.

They were taken from a gantry at a height of approximately 50ft to simulate the visual picture on approach.


The existing Halogen Bulb
https://www.airliners.net/uf/78503/1447948265Er3B4f.png


The new LED landing light
https://www.airliners.net/uf/78503/1447948283vKAkov.png


The LED lighting array
https://www.airliners.net/uf/78503/14479491277dsaT7.jpg

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:50 pm
by AAR90
Quoting barney captain (Reply 8):
Was this the new design (elimination of the taxi light) or a relamp of the existing taxi light to LED?

Relamp of the Nose Taxi Light. AA pilots have no information on "new design" features that arrive with new aircraft so IF there are any AA 738s with the LED Landing Light Array... I will only know if/when I fly one of those. But I have seen (and flown) plenty of AA 738s with the LED Nose Taxi Light.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 6:02 pm
by yeelep
Quoting barney captain (Reply 4):
My guess is that this will be the new standard. I know there is a new pedestal coming out as well that will match the MAX

Our next delivery will have the new pedestal.

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2015 6:32 am
by andrej
Quoting Dogbreath (Reply 11):
The new LED landing light

It's like a whole new World! Pretty nice.  

Can the LED landing lighting be retrofitted on other types, such as B744, B767?

RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:21 pm
by Western727
Question: why weren't xenon landing lights installed on Boeing or Airbus aircraft prior to the recent widespread use of LEDs? I recall NW/DL's CR9s having those and watching the distinctive "flicker" upon the lights getting turned on, like those in a 2007 car of mine that had xenon headlights.

Re: RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 10:58 pm
by flyingcello
Western727 wrote:
Question: why weren't xenon landing lights installed on Boeing or Airbus aircraft prior to the recent widespread use of LEDs? I recall NW/DL's CR9s having those and watching the distinctive "flicker" upon the lights getting turned on, like those in a 2007 car of mine that had xenon headlights.


Perhaps the need to provide Xenons with High Voltage? Technically not challenging, but maybe it would have created a certification issue?

Re: RE: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:01 am
by NameOmitted
Western727 wrote:
Separate question: will the red anticollision strobes get changed to LEDs from LN #5555 and up, too? I think it'd look a bit funny if the LTRTL and white wingtip flashers are all LED while the red fuselage lights stay strobes.


Lighting designer here. I can't speak directly to industrial LEDs, but in general it is a lot easier to produce blue light than red light with an LED. There is so little red light that naturally comes from an LED you need a much more powerful lamp with much more heat dissipation from the electronics to deliver a meaningful amount of light maybe it through a red filter.

This is speculation, I have no direct experience with aviation maintenance.

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 1:09 pm
by parmelbe
The difference is remarkable. All of our -700's and older -800's have the old bulbs and our newer -800's are coming in with the LED's. You can tell from the terminal if you have a new -800 incoming from the lights when the jet is on final. Also, pretty sure from what I've seen ours have the nose gear light eliminated. I'd have to check again, though.

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 3:46 pm
by StereoTechque
I dont know if anyone else has observed, but the LED's installed in the 787 and the 380 (Guess the Taxi and Runway T/O) have a more yellowish beam rather than pure bright white LED's on the 320 and the 737. Ill always prefer a yellowish white light over the pure white light as it is less irritating to the reciprocal traffic, also it is less prone to glare on objects.

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 5:44 am
by ATA L1011
Will be interesting to see how many operators with low cycle/hours 737 NG/Classics without LED's retrofit as it is available or about to be for both! http://www.talonaerospace.com/products/ ... /wing-tail

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 12:03 pm
by keesje
Seems several options for LED replacements are available / certified now for various aircraft types.

http://www.modstore.aero/modifications/type(71)/Boeing_737%20NextGen/modificationId(28916)/Sealed%20Beam%20Replacement%20Lamps%20-%20LED

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 6:22 pm
by tjwgrr
keesje wrote:
Seems several options for LED replacements are available / certified now for various aircraft types.

http://www.modstore.aero/modifications/type(71)/Boeing_737%20NextGen/modificationId(28916)/Sealed%20Beam%20Replacement%20Lamps%20-%20LED


I saw an interesting thing today, a DL MD90 (N962DN) with the starboard wingtip landing light, along with the wingtip white flashing light replaced with LED, but the port side wing and nose lights still using incandescent bulbs and strobe. A mix of new and old...... looked rather odd.

Re: New 737 LED Landing Lights Question(s)

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:02 pm
by keesje
I think Techops is installing Talon LED on the MD fleet.