Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
flpuck6
Topic Author
Posts: 2047
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 1999 12:32 am

FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 2:05 am

Hey Folks,

It's official. While the repsonse is most likely a generic one, there is one VERY key part for us aviation photographer/spotters to read, to print out, to carry with us, and kindly make MP, NG, police officers, security personnel aware of. The response was long, but here is the most important part:


Thank you for taking the time to contact us. We appreciate your
suggestion and concern for the nation's aviation. Due to the heavy volume of
mail that we experienced and our desire to answer each letter, we have
not been able to reply to some correspondence in a timely matter.
Please accept our apology for the delay in responding.

Film/Photography
Some questions have been raised about photography in and around
airports. We'd like to clarify that neither the Security Directives (SD) that
have been issued over that past few months nor Title 14, Code of
Federal Regulations, Part 107-airport Security, and Part 108-Airplane
Operator Security, contain restrictions or prohibitions on photography. We
encourage you to keep abreast of any regulatory proposals for enhanced
airport security to ensure that the concerns of professional photographers
are considered fully.

Please accept our appreciation for taking the time to share your
thoughts and concerns with us. Your support and cooperation is an important
contribution to ensuring the safety and security of the Nation's
aviation system.
Most Sincerely,
Tell FAA Response Team


If you would like the entire message, let me know:
[email protected]

-Chris/PVD/CLE
Bonjour Chef!
 
Lindy
Posts: 4722
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 10:42 pm

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 2:09 am

Yes, please send it to me at : [email protected]

Thanks,
Rafal
BWIADCA - Nikon D100
 
Guest

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 2:49 am

Hmmm, its like a Bill of Rights! Big grin
 
OH-LZA
Posts: 971
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2001 12:29 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 3:05 am

Why not just post it here? I bet your mailbox will soon be quite full of "Please send me the response" messages  Big grin.

Alexander
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 3:31 am

How did you get it? Was it an e-mail or an actual letter? If it's a letter, then it would really be great if you could scan a copy of the whole letter, which we can print out which would include the letterhead.

Great stuff.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
EWRvirgin
Posts: 348
Joined: Tue May 15, 2001 11:38 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 3:31 am

I'd like to see the entire message also.

[email protected]
 
Guest

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:13 am

Sounds pretty good;

The term "professional photographer" sounds funny though.... Are they really talking about us airplane-spotters??
 
H. Simpson
Posts: 933
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2001 7:30 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:39 am

at least it's better than confusion! thanks Flpuck6!

p.s. does your name sounds a little offense...?
 
tpk
Posts: 188
Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2000 4:48 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 5:35 am

Chris,

I would also appreciate a copy if you get a chance.

[email protected]

Thanks.

Tim
 
peachair
Posts: 217
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 4:00 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 5:47 am

This is great news, but I wonder if this FAA response has anything to do with local airport authority, in other words - individual airport rules or regulations.

The FAA may be OK with it, but even though the new security directives don't say anything about photography, what if an airport has their own state or local government rules about aviation photography at the airport? It would be interesting to see if we could get just one major airport to send us their Local policy.

Thanks
b
 
CcrlR
Posts: 2195
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2001 9:24 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 6:29 am

Please E mail me what they sent you and I will complain to them and tell them that this is not illegal! My E mail address is on my profile.
"He was right, it is a screaming metal deathtrap!"-Cosmo (from the Fairly Oddparents)
 
mikephotos
Posts: 2888
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2000 12:52 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 6:34 am

Carl..I think you misread. Their response was that it is NOT illegal. Something I knew all along but try telling that to joecop at the airport  Smile

Michael
 
CcrlR
Posts: 2195
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2001 9:24 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 6:47 am

Yeah that's what you try to tell them that but they say it's illegal but it's not really.
"He was right, it is a screaming metal deathtrap!"-Cosmo (from the Fairly Oddparents)
 
flpuck6
Topic Author
Posts: 2047
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 1999 12:32 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 7:12 am

Hi everyone---

I did anticipate the dozens of messages asking me to forward the message. One reason why I did it that way is because that way the actual e-mail addresses are visible and that way one can tell it actually did come from a direct communication between me and the FAA.

Secondly, the message is really long. I will, however, post it in the next message.

I should have clarified that this is a response to an e-mail which I sent to them via their website communicating to them our genuine interest in the hobby/industry and the increasing number of negative incidents between 100% innocent spotters/photographers and credible and non-credible personnel.

I even sent out a few typed out letters via regular mail but have not received a response from those. This, in my opinion, is a much more effective way of communicating, albeit without the official letterhead, but it is still, without any doubt, an official communication.

Lastly, let's not forget the FAA is a GOVERNMENT organization. I do not understand how LOCAL airport "rules" can overrule GOVERNMENT laws/regulations/clarifications.

Thanks a lot for your support guys.

-Chris

H. Simpson, what do you mean by "does my name sound a little offense..."??? (it's really my brother's initials 'F' and 'L', then the word 'puck' as in hockey puck, and the #6, his lucky number. long story)
Bonjour Chef!
 
flpuck6
Topic Author
Posts: 2047
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 1999 12:32 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 7:13 am


Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:52:50 -0500

From: "9-AWA-TELLFAA-RESPONSE" <[email protected]> | Block Address | Add to Address Book

To: [email protected]

Subject: Re:aviation photography






Thank you for taking the time to contact us. We appreciate your
suggestion and concern for the nation's aviation. Due to the heavy volume of
mail that we experienced and our desire to answer each letter, we have
not been able to reply to some correspondence in a timely matter.
Please accept our apology for the delay in responding.
In the after math of the events of September 11, the Federal Aviation
Administration (FAA) immediately implemented enhanced security measures
to provide for the safety of the traveling public. The Secretary of
Transportation established two Rapid Response Teams to address security
concerns. Their initial report was prepared on October 1, 2001.
Significant changes in procedures were made at all our nation's airports to
tighten security. In the coming months the newly formed Transportation
Security Administration (TSA) will be working to implement the
provisions of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act (P.L. 107-71), signed
by President Bush on November 19, 2001. For the first time, aviation
security will become a direct Federal responsibility, overseen by a new
Under Secretary of Transportation for Security. The full text of the
Act can be found at: http://thomas.loc.gov/ by searching for S.1450.
There have been numerous reports taken to evaluate security breaches
and performances across the board. Subsequently, the FAA began a process
of identifying, collecting and evaluating suggestions that might offer
improvements to aviation security. Many comments from the public were
included in that process. To protect vital security protocols, the
details of some steps must remain classified. The FAA cannot discuss
certain safety-sensitive details that would make it easier for terrorists
to attack innocent people. We can report that prior to the passage of
the TSA legislation, the FAA had already started strengthening security
measures at airports. For example, the airlines have completed cockpit
door reinforcements system-wide. We have deployed a substantially
expanded number of Federal Air Marshals, and are training an even larger
force.
Because of the variety of questions that have been asked of the FAA, we
have put together some answers to of few most frequently asked
questions. If your particular concern or question require a more detailed
answer please call the Tell FAA Hotline @ 1-866-829-9673 and we will be
glade to direct you to the person or persons needed to resolve your
concern. Also, continue to check the FAA website at http://faa.gov for
continual updates.
Airport Security Searches and Screening
There is a great deal of interest about the requirement regarding
checked bag screening. Working with the airlines, the FAA and TSA have
taken the necessary action to meet this requirement. Airports are being
reconfigured and personnel trained so that every available explosive
detection system (EDS) machine can be used to its maximum capacity. Where
there is no EDS resource in place, we will use other options outlined
in the law. On origination flights, baggage will be matched to its
passenger; computers will screen passengers, and passengers will be
screened for weapons-often multiple times. More bags will also be subject to
sniffing by trained dogs. There will be comprehensive screening by
both explosive trace detection devices, to manual searches, or to a
combination of both. As resources become available we will continuously
upgrade our screening capability, ultimately meeting the requirement that
each checked bag be screened by an explosive detection system by th!
e end of this year. Additionally, we are looking at a wide variety of
innovative approaches using technology in different ways to run the
check-in process and procurement strategies that can get us to the goal.
Civil Aviation Security Specialists (FAM / Baggage Screeners)
Civil Aviation Security Specialists focus on a number of areas such as
general airport/air carrier security; hazardous materials and cargo
security; physical security; and personal security. The most popular of
the positions are the Federal
Air Marshals and Airport Security Screeners. Those interested should
inquire through the FAA Career Opportunities website at:
http://jobs.faa.gov.
Security Screener
You can find detailed requirement standards for Security Screener
Positions at: job.faa.gov/SecurityScreeningRequirements.htm or call the DOT
Connection toll-free at 1-866-404-1227 to leave your name and mailing
address. They will send you application information as soon as it is
available, at which time we will begin accepting applications.
Federal Air Marshals
Federal Air Marshals (FAMs) respond to criminal incidents aboard U.S.
air carriers, as well as other in-flight emergencies. FAMs are
authorized to carry firearms and make arrests while preserving the safety of
aircraft, crew, and passengers. Eligibility and qualification
requirements including post-appointment training, which is extensive. FAMs must
be U.S. citizens; eligible for a Top Secret security clearance; undergo
extensive training, certification, and physical exams; and are subject
to drug and alcohol testing. Due to mandatory retirement age and
years-of-service requirements for Federal employees, candidates for FAMs
cannot be initially appointed on or after their 40th birthday, however
previous experience in a covered Federal law enforcement officer position
may exempt candidates from this age requirement. This is a highly
focused, specialized unique occupation and not everyone (including those
currently in law enforcement) is an ideal match for the position requ!
irements.
All applications for FAMs must be submitted online, at
http://jobs.faa.gov. The agency will no longer consider paper
applications.
Volunteers
Unfortunately, the FAA cannot accept volunteers for most of its
programs, including the FAM program. However, many national service
organizations and most local communities have organizations that need a variety
of volunteer help. Your expertise or time may be needed right in your
own community. Please consider contacting local organizations that
interest you for further information.
VFR Information
On Sept. 21, the FAA lifted many of the restrictions place on flight
training operations conducted under Part 91 of the Federal Aviation
Regulations. On Sept. 19, the FAA authorized limited return of general
aviation Part 91 visual flight rules operations, or VFR, flights. Instrument
Flight Rules, or IFR, flights were authorized on Sept. 14. If you are a
general aviation pilot and want to fly VFR, please familiarize yourself
with the text of the NOTAM. If you are unsure of your authorization
status, please contact your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WXBRIEF.
VFR pilots must receive a full briefing from their Flight Service
Station or DUATS, as well as familiarize themselves with the text of the
NOTAM.
Technical Suggestion
In addition, the Secretary of Transportation established two Rapid
Response Teams to address security. Their initial reports were made on
October 1, and already, significant changes in procedures are in place at
all our Nation's airports to tighten security. Shortly after the
attacks the FAA began a process to identify, collect and evaluate the many
technical and procedural suggestions that came in offering improvements
to aviation security. An independent review body, the American
Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics, evaluated all suggestions. While
other actions, such as the strengthening of cockpit doors, are underway,
the initial reports may be viewed at:
http://www.dot.gov/affairs/airportsec.htm
http://www.dot.gov/affairs/aircraftsec.htm
Opportunities to sell products or services to the FAA will be published
on the internet. I encourage you to visit the FAA's "Contracting
Opportunities" website (http://www.asu.faa.gov/faaco/), where you can review
current procurement announcements and subscribe to e-mail notification
of new contracting opportunities. There may also be business
opportunities with airlines directly as a result of the $20 million grant
program to develop new technologies for heightened aircraft security.
Further information on the grant program is available at the following
website: http://www.faa.gov/AVR/AIR/TIGER-Team/Tiger
Film/Photography
Some questions have been raised about photography in and around
airports. We'd like to clarify that neither the Security Directives (SD) that
have been issued over that past few months nor Title 14, Code of
Federal Regulations, Part 107-airport Security, and Part 108-Airplane
Operator Security, contain restrictions or prohibitions on photography. We
encourage you to keep abreast of any regulatory proposals for enhanced
airport security to ensure that the concerns of professional photographers
are considered fully.
Knitting Needles
Thank you for your inquiry to the Federal Aviation Administration about
taking knitting needles aboard commercial flights. Although there is
no specific prohibition on knitting needles, the current atmosphere of
enhanced security makes it unlikely that knitting needles will be
allowed to pass through security screening at this time. While we realize
that this is an inconvenience, you may want to put them in your checked
luggage. We suggest contacting your airline directly for clarification
of the airline's screening policy.
Please accept our appreciation for taking the time to share your
thoughts and concerns with us. Your support and cooperation is an important
contribution to ensuring the safety and security of the Nation's
aviation system.
Most Sincerely,
Tell FAA Response Team


Bonjour Chef!
 
scottysair
Posts: 6441
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 4:07 pm

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 9:32 am

Oh please let them go with the people want go to through at the gate area again and takedown with the passengers sign at the every airport and I do not want to see it with the sign and I hate to said something with Only Ticketed Passengers sign at the checkpoint is out! And need to stop during that with the passengers signed at the checkpoint and let them people are go through at the checkpoint and need to stop wasting of the longer lines with the people are goes through through at the security checkpoint. So plaese let them go, got it!!
 
C-GRYK
Posts: 728
Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2000 4:55 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 9:53 am

Scotty should be all of you US spotter's spokesperson to the FAA  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Let us non passengers past security, got it!!! VERY demanding and to the point! Good job buddy.

Jeremy
Think before you type!
 
5280AGL
Posts: 398
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2001 6:50 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 10:26 am

Scotty is our forum mascot.  Nuts

I believe he is from the Miami Home For the Totally Phucked. Or from the "MASOAWWLT" = Miami Area School of Adults Who Write Like Toddlers. Can't remember which.
 
Alaskaairlines
Posts: 2326
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 12:28 pm

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 11:46 am

Oh thats great news! I will definatley keep that with me when I start spotting soon!

Thanks, Dmitry.  Smile
 
Jer32382
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2003 10:35 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:12 pm

In regards to my response about scotty, i'm sorry. i didn't know he was deaf. (thats what i was told) so please disregard my post about the incoherenct of the post. honest mistake on my part
 
chris28_17
Posts: 1372
Joined: Sun Jul 09, 2000 4:26 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:44 pm

You best not be disrespectin' scotty, he's cool.

 
b764
Posts: 740
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2001 10:49 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 9:34 pm

please forward a copy to me.

[email protected]
 
L-188
Posts: 29881
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 1999 11:27 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Thu Feb 14, 2002 9:42 pm

You know what we should do.

There was a suggestiong that somebody make a "I'm an Airplane Spotter not a criminal" T-shirt.

Lets put that statement on the front and on the back place "neither the Security Directives (SD) that
have been issued over that past few months nor Title 14, Code of
Federal Regulations, Part 107-airport Security, and Part 108-Airplane
Operator Security, contain restrictions or prohibitions on photography........FAA Response Team "

That way if the airport nazi's say anything we can just tell them to read.....

But I wonder if that will help since these airport security screeners aren't going to be required to have a high school education. They might not be able to read.  Nuts

I think every airport spotter should have one  Smokin cool
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
User avatar
Bruce
Posts: 4947
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 2:46 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Fri Feb 15, 2002 4:07 am

Very good Chris....thanks! I'm going to print it out...


bruce
Bruce Leibowitz - Jackson, MS (KJAN) - Canon 50D/100-400L IS lens
 
peachair
Posts: 217
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 4:00 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Fri Feb 15, 2002 4:29 am

Chris -

I understand the FAA is a government organization with government rules. But I will give you an example of "Local" rules. I am in the parking lot behind Dobbs, in my car with my camera next to the old Flying Tigers and TWA hangars. Perfect shots for 24L. I show the FAA's repsonse that you forwarded us to the Department of Airports cop who asks me to leave. The response: "The city of Los Angeles owns this property not the FAA" you are not allowed to take photographs according the Department of Airports which is an LA City property.

This is what I mean by "Local" rules - it has happened to me at several airports. Just reporting facts.........
 
flpuck6
Topic Author
Posts: 2047
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 1999 12:32 am

RE: FAA Official Response To Photography!

Fri Feb 15, 2002 4:56 am

Peachair--

I was talking with a fellow a.net member about
the jurisdiction of federal vs. local. The letter does not explicitly state
that photography IS legal and my arguement is that it
states that there are NO restrictions/prohibitions at all.
The fellow member did bring to my attention the
fact that that leaves room for the local security
agencies/airport security ops to then say their own
rules overrule those (or the lack of) the FAA, like you have experienced. I just find it hard to understand how a supposedly higher power can get overruled by local regulations.

But honesly, I know it'll take some time and we have
to use common sense. But so do those goshdarn
MP/NG/Cops/Security personnel! We're the last people
on the face of this planet to engage in any
compromising activity. It's time we stop being so
passive. I just hate being passive.
Bonjour Chef!

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos