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alphazulu
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Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 5:28 am

Has anyone out there experienced increased aggression on the part of the LAPD or airport police in the last week? I ask this question because a good friend of mine who was visiting from Belgium was taking pictures on Northside Parkway just north of 24R when the police stopped and wanted to examine his camera.
If your familiar with the area then you know the only way to get a shot of the aircraft arriving on the 24's is to step up on the guard rail and shoot over the fence. He was also warned not to do that and told to leave.
Now, the only reason I am asking this question is that in the past the police would just drive by and not bother the photographers or spotters, at least to this degree. I sure hope this isn't a taste of things to come and is only a isolated incident.

Paul
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 8:33 am

Perhaps just parking on the side street the connects over to Westchester Pkwy is a little less risky. I mean the side street is elevated and would provide good shots as well without being against the fence....Ry
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 9:13 am

Both spots are good for photos ( No Parking signs all over) as well as Westchester Parkway down near the Lincoln under pass. But the point is the police never behaved this way before, at least in the last 7 months and I'm wondering what's up.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 11:18 am

Are they claiming the “federal government” has outlawed photography? If they are, then they’re full of B.S. The federal government, the Transportation Security Administration(TSA), FAA, or any other federal agency has not made it illegal to take pictures. Los Angeles might have made it illegal but not the feds.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 11:49 am

I've sent my friend an e-mail asking for further details on his encounter with the LAPD and will update my post if I have anything new..................
 
b757300
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 22, 2002 11:55 am

If they claim it was the "feds", I'll post a letter I got from the TSA. Its a large file so I don't want to inflict it on the modem users out there.
 
EWRvirgin
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 6:14 am

If you were on a highway all they said was 'you can't take pictures here' then the police are perfectly justified. You can't just pull over on the side of a highway. Its considered unsafe if not outright illegal. Unless the cops are picking on you at other safe locations I would hold it against them that they made you move.
 
chrisair
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 8:12 am

That road isn't a highway...It doesn't have 7 lanes in each direction  Smile

I was there last month, and I saw one cop who smiled and waved, and then continued driving...Unlike Miami where one cop slowed down, took a very long look at me, then drove off slowly...

 
2912n
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 10:38 am

Not to sound snotty, but have you watched the news lately? If you think the news is bombarded with threats, try it on the police side. Not only are there the official threats that come down, but all sorts of people call in about the "suspicious activity" that people with cameras at airport fences create.

Enough calls come in and it becomes a pain in the ass to the cops. Hence they chase people away. Don't be suprised to see "No Loitering" signs posted at some of those spots in the not too distant future.

If you are contacted by the police just use common sense. Explain what you are doing, what your hobby is and don't be a jerk. 99.999% of the time you will be treated the same way that you treat the cops.
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 12:34 pm

We get those threats all the time! I'm so sick of them, it's almost like a disclaimer for the government in case something happens. And yes there are "No Loitering" signs all over the place. But the police never asked any questions before, they would just pass by like they could care less. Anyone in the LAX area experienced this type of behaviour by the LAPD? Let us know.......................
 
EWRvirgin
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 12:58 pm

Chris, are you talking about the Northside Parkway referenced in the original post by Alphazulu. I can't be sure but that sounds like a highway to me!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Also that a roadway has one lane or seven is immaterial. A shoulder is technically for emergencies and/or breakdowns.

If you do that here on the NJ Turnpike along EWR you can expect a pretty rude response!
 
chrisair
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Thu May 23, 2002 1:14 pm

I'm talking about that road on the north side (24 side). It's Westchester Parkway I believe. I've shot there before, and it's right off the "highway" (more like a big street) on another road that runs the north side perimeter. I wouldn't suggest shooting there anymore...it wasn't very good before 9/11...

Any highway in California has something like 7 lanes and millions of cars, or 2 lanes and millions of cars.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Fri May 24, 2002 1:22 am

The Heat Is On!!!
Going to work this morning I heard a news report on the radio that the city of Los Angeles will close down four streets around LAX. And you guessed it, Northside Parkway is one of them. The only other street I recognised was Sandpiper St. just off of Pershing Dr.
It's a sad day Sad for all of us as a few more spots have been taken away. And for those of you who suggested that Northside parkway wasn't a good place to take photos, take a look at the picture below, I think it speaks for itself!
Paul

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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 2:32 am

Gee that SUCKS!!!  Pissed  Pissed

I love Sandpiper when 6L/6R are in use...

btw Paul, I was at LAX all summer last year, and twice when I tried to shoot at that exact spot, by climbing up on the guard rail, I was told to get down. The cops usually don't mind as long as your not doing something weird.
Anyway, I prefer using the bridge over Lincoln Blvd because it has nice little wooden blocks to sit on Big grin The only thing thats anoying there are the light poles that get in the way...

-Clovis
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 3:18 am

I know the spot your talking about Clovis, it's on Westchester Parkway. And yes the light poles on Lincoln get in the way, you just have to get a good shot inbetween the poles, Nuts not that easy.
Plus, who knows if they will fence off you spot by Lincoln Blvd. under crossing, It really makes me mad Angry
Please enjoy another shot from (soon to be closed, if not already) Northside Parkway.
Paul

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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 5:18 am

Those are some really nice pictures, I actually have your pic of the hawaiian DC-10-30 as my desktop right now, it reminds me of LAX Big grin Big grin Big grin I like the hollywood sign at the tip of the tail  Laugh out loud

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-Clov
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 7:02 am

Thanks Clovis, Big thumbs up It's now summer (almost) here in SO CAL and that means SMOG. So don't expect many shots with the Hollywood sign in the background, we'll be lucky to see the aircraft.
Paul

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chrisair
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 8:40 am

I don't believe that Paul...how are people going to get to their houses, and to the beaches? Besides, you can always walk along the fence on the north side (it's one hell of a hike though) and get some decent shots through the trees...
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 10:48 am

I sometimes park on Loyola Blvd. and walk down to the fence at Northside Parkway, but I'm not sure how far the city of LA will take this. Will they put a fence along Westchester Parkway so you can't even get near 24R or just block off the street. I'm planning to drive down to LAX in the next few weeks or so and will update you at that time. If someone has a report before me please let us know...............
Paul
 
N178UA
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 2:50 pm

Hi Paul (Alphazulu)

Somehow today I got a messge fowarded to my email:

L.A. Tightens Security at Airport, Apartments


May 23, 2002 2:38 pm EST

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - City authorities have closed four streets near the
runways of Los Angeles International Airport and issued guidelines to
apartment managers about suspicious activities by tenants in line with
nationwide warnings about potential new attacks against the United States.
The measures, which took effect late Wednesday, followed a spate of warnings
from Washington about enhanced activity among operatives of Osama bin
Laden's al Qaeda network, and a specific FBI alert for New York.

Although authorities said they had no specific information regarding Los
Angeles, police and city officials decided, as a precaution, to close to
public traffic four streets that border LAX runways.

Los Angeles Police also issued a detailed set of guidelines to property
managers following an FBI warning last week of a possible plot by al Qaeda
followers to detonate bombs in rented apartments across the United States.

The guidelines urged caution toward tenants paying cash, using only rental
vehicles and those moving items such as machinery, fireworks or compressed
air tanks into apartments, or evidence of digging or trenching near ground
floor units.

Los Angeles, the nation's second-largest city, has been particularly alert
following the Sept. 11 attacks on the Pentagon and the World Trade Center
because its airport was cited as one of the targets in a failed plot by
Algerian extremists to bomb U.S. buildings over the millennium.


Speaking of LAX shooting, I LOVE IT too! Especially the Imperial Hill, is the best try out place for the 400mm long rangers....


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You got the idea...

Sam


 
chrisair
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 4:46 pm

Wow, I guess they did close them...still makes no sense to me...Thanks for the article Sam...
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sat May 25, 2002 6:18 pm

Well, acoording to my Grandpa, he got a new apartment with two balconys that overlook the north complex (24R/24L) so even if they do close those streets, this summer is still looking good Big grin  Big thumbs up
But they must have then closed Aviation Blvd huh? Cause' its right on the thresholds of the 25 runways...that would be a major bummer...  Sad
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 12:01 am

Hi Sam,

Thanks so much for your interest in little old LAX, and the article from the LA Times was quite interesting.

As I said at the top of this thread about my friend from Belgium, something was up with regards to LAX as far back as last Sunday. And who really knows what the truth is, we keep getting those threats and everyone is scared S***less!

Though, there was an explosion at a apartment building yesterday on the west side of the San Fernando Valley, kinda suspicious.

Sam, your sure right about LAX, it's a wonderful place to take pictures. And you can't find a better place to take photos than the Imperial Hill. But variety is the spice of life and shutting down Northside Parkway is taking one more angle away from us! But, I will seek out new locations only hoping I don't get in trouble doing it.

Clovis, don't worry about Aviation Blvd. That's a major road for traffic north and south and it would take something (at the airport) catastrophic for that to happen.

Please enjoy some shots from the Imperial Hill! Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Paul

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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 2:23 am

Paul, just to get an idea, what lens do you need for say a B757 on the runway from Imperial Hill and is this spot tolerated by the cops?
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 4:18 am

In the shot above the United 757 was landing on 7R which is not the norm. 90 percent of the time the prevailing winds are from the ocean and aircraft will takeoff and land from 25L or 25R. So where the jets rotate is usually further down (to the east) unless they are at MGTW or near it.

Now to answer some of your questions. A 400mm lens is probably adequate to take shots of a 757, but as I said it all depends where they rotate. It's always better if there heavy as the Imperial Hill is 3/4 the way down 25L&R and 1/4 the way down 7L&R.

As for security, the Imperial Hill is located on a residential street that happens to have a wonderful view of the 25's. But it's located in a different city (El Segundo) than Los Angeles. So it's a different police agency and they have a different view of things. All times of the day and night you can find locals as well as photographers and spotters doing there thing. There are benches to sit on, trash cans to keep things clean around the area and about room for 10 to 15 cars to park, very user friendly. I guess you could call this a designated viewer area. Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Here are a few shots of 757 (and one 747) taking off from 25R.

Paul

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N178UA
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 9:37 am

Hi Paul

I am always interested in LAX, although traffic is still slow in my opinion than before S-11 level. Recently by pass LAX , nothing much changed, my next time will be 2/July a short stopover on my way to Buenos Aires.

It is a shame that Northside Parkway spot if having quite lots of trouble. But keep remember Northside Parkway is only good for summer time, after 4pm somehow when the sun over the top and goes to the other side, in Winter, sun will be against you all the time.


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but more to my concern are the following spots:

1. Northwest/Gateway Cargo Parking lot at the end of 25s.

2. DHL Cargo Employee Parking lot for photos on short final on 25s and Cargo taxing ..

3. Imperial Terminal.

4. Northside on 24 Arrivals, the Limo Park and Cab holding area.

5. Parking Lot C if spot at 4 is off limit.

All these spot (as you would know) are decent for landing shots or some sort of taxing when plane slows down.

I got 2 email this morning concern about this and they told me so far the 25 end is preety ok still, but they will go out today to check it out more..

The other option left for us is get on a cool LAX Ramp tour now!  Big thumbs up


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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 1:51 pm

Hi again Sam,

Just received an e-mail from a friend who spent from 9A to 3P today at LAX. A lot of overcast and haze so things weren't the best for taking pictures. He did check out Northside Parkway and Sandpiper and there still open. The announcement to close these streets was made on Friday but like everything else it probably won't happen until Tuesday (Monday is a holiday in the USA) or beyond.

I really like your shot of the Philippines 747. As you mentioned the best time to take pictures at Northside Parkway would be after 4p and right around June 21, you know the summer solstice. I love the orange hew the late afternoon sun cast on the aircraft. I have included a shot from 11-25-01 of a Malaysian 747 with this warm glow about it. Yes, I know, mostly in the shadows but I still think it looks good.

As far as the spots you mentioned (1-5) I think all of them are still open. My friend visited a few of them today.

Paul

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N178UA
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 5:16 pm

Hi Paul

11-25-01, while you are shooting the MH on 24R on Northside, Guess where am I? I was at the end of 25L parking lot busy shooting too! I am not sure if I came across you before in LAX.  Confused

Yes, I know next week they will start to block roads off, wait till then we'll see which roads they will block, got any email from Roy Lock mentioned the spots on south side will be in danger..

We'll see and this is not a good news in any where.

Sam
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 8:19 pm

Thanks for all the info Paul.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 9:27 pm

There's also a 7-11 and a good Donut shop at the end the Imperial hill, good place to get snacks and drink, which is essential during the summer Big grin Those are things that other spots like Aviation Blvd and the Northside (Lincoln/Westchester) don't have.
Of course, I still think the best place is In-N-Out Big grin

+

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=
 Big grin Big grin Big grin Big grin Big grin Big grin
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 11:31 pm

Ok Clovis, your making me hungry! Philippe Bleus who visited me from Belgium took this shot (see below) of the Hawaiian Air DC-10 on a visit with me to Northside Parkway.
And when it was time for lunch we mad our way to where? You guessed it, In And Out  Big thumbs up As in the photos above, we sat at the second table from the left and had two famous "Double Double" Innocent Animal Style + there famous (freshly cut, not frozen) french fries and a soft drink, Dr Pepper for me. I know this sounds like a promotion for In And Out but there the BEST Smile/happy/getting dizzy In the time we sat there we must of had close to 20 to 25 jets pass by. At least 5 747, 2 or 3 MD-11 and the rest were 757's, 767's, A-320, and so on, you get the picture.
As for the 7-11, you can get a frozen ice drink (like slush) that has different flavors like coke, cherry, tropical fruit, that will really hit's the spot on a hard day of spotting at the Imperial Hill. All you have to do is drive west (towards the ocean) about two blocks and your there, you can't miss it!
Say Clovis, In the second picture below are those yellow apartments or condos or townhouses, or what ever, your grandpappy's place of residents? If so you have a perfect place to watch the 24's.
Paul

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timdegroot
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Sun May 26, 2002 11:36 pm

Now I've only been to LAX once so I'm not very familiar with the surroundings.
But when I was there back in '99 I spent the mornings at a restaurant's garden, which was also a museum which included some planes.
Is it still possible to spot here, because it was an excellent place.

Tim
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 4:45 am

Hi Tim,
I'm not sure what restaurant your talking about, can you be a little more specific. Was it on the north side around the 24's or the south side by the 25's.
There is a lovely restaurant called the Proud Bird off the 25's. It has large picture windows with old fighter jets and planes displayed just outside in a garden setting. This restaurant has been there for more than 35 years. I remember eating there in the late 60 with my grandmother and great aunt, it sure brings back memories of a time long ago. But it continues on today as I had dinner there about 2 weeks ago, and the food is always good and the view even better!
So let me know a little more details about the restaurant your talking about and I may try it myself.
Paul
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 4:52 am

Sorry Tim, It sounds like your talking about the Proud Bird Restaurant, I'm almost sure of it. I didn't read your post fully and now that I have I'll bet money on it. Is that the one, let us know..................
Paul
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 5:00 am

They concoct killer Cadillac Margaritas there too, and the Prime Rib sandwich for lunch is excellent (ask for the real horseradish). The lunchtime all-you-can-hog buffet is only so-so, but the Sunday brunch is superb.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 5:51 am

Also........ GREAT Margaritas on the rocks......... Plus a great earleybird (4:30 til 6:00p) special consisting of prime rib, or chicken, or fish plus a nice slice of cheesecake Love for only $10.95, what a deal!
 
timdegroot
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 6:49 am

Yes it must be the Proud bird restaurant. There are indeed some fighter planes there, and a (replica) of the X1 I beleive.
I loved that place, the only disadvantage was a tree that sometimes got in the viewfinder of my camera, so you had to work around it.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 8:51 am



I was in the north east Parking lot of the Proud Bird on 5/23 trying to grab some shots of the arrivals on the 25's. An LAPD patrol unit stopped and asked for my ID. They were decent. They didn't shoo me away. Next time, I'm stopping in for one of those Cadillacs.


Bob
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Mon May 27, 2002 1:08 pm

Bob,
The LAPD aren't to bad, they understand about spotting and photography but they are only following orders. As I said at the top of this thread they sometimes just drive by like you aren't even there.
Have you tried the Northwest cargo parking lot on the south side of 25L? It's great for shots like the one below.
Paul

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rgrand
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Tue May 28, 2002 5:04 am

Paul:

yah, they were very nice. The gal was VERY nice.

That is stunning photo. I'll have to give the Northwest lot a try. I am always impressed at the resolution you and the other regular contributors seem to obtain in your photos. My negatives always seem to lose something in the scanning process.

I had what I thought would be a great shot the other day. I was set up Imperial Ave when I saw what had to be one of the last few remaining TWA 767's in the original paint scheme. It was being towed from the AA maintenance hanger area to the gate. I cranked off a few shots (I have a Canon A2 with Vivitar 100-300 zoom). They turned out grainy and not much detail. I'm thinking I should switch lenses to Sigma

Anyway..thanks for the info on the Northwest lot

Bob
 
flyboeingjets
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Tue May 28, 2002 10:55 am

As a huge fan of Northside Parkway, I hope that this does not actually occur. Wouldn't that create serious traffic problems for people that live in that residential area adjacent to the road? I'll believe it when I see it....
 Sad
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Tue May 28, 2002 5:09 pm

Looks like I will be driving to LAS, SAN, and PHX more this winter to shoot. I need a break from shooting at LAX anyways.
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 1:52 am

I just got JustPlanes DVD of Los Angeles, its 180 minutes Big grin Lots of fun Big grin

They used alot of different locations here're the most prominent...
-The ATC Tower for Arrivals on all runways Smile
-Aviation Blvd A/C lining up 25s
-BETWEEN rwy 25L/25R for touchdown 25L
(You have to see it Big grin)
-Near the intersection of taxiway D and S (crossover) on the northside to get arrivals 24R/L (with a nice evening double 747 arrival Big grin )
-Near Imperial Hill, but at the foot of taxiway T for rollout 25, departure/climbout and for arrivals 7L/R

They actually have a good amount of footage of 7/6 usage, some during a heavy rain storm. Also some close ups of aircraft at the gates at night, Freighters, and the various maintenance areas...

Good fun if you want an idea of what goes in and out of LAX...
I suggest surround sound and a good sub-woofer to get maximum experience Big grin Big grin

-Clovis
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 6:25 am

Ok, what will be, will be............. Enough about Northside Parkway............
For those of you who love LAX and are familiar with the operations and flight patterns (and even if your not) I have a wonderful web-site for you to check out.
It was conceived of by the city of LA to track, identify, and report noise problems with aircraft arriving and departing LAX. But I find it handy ( from a spotter and photographer standpoint) to view activity in and out of LAX. It's like watching the radar screen at ATC and you have the ability to do a replay of any date and time up to three months before.
I started using the replay feature to identify the flight number and city of origin or destination whatever the case might be.
So, with that in mind I posted a picture with all the info to track the last 10 minutes of NWA906 to TD on 25L.
If you would like to view it just click on this link http://www1.passur.com/lax.html and put in the date of April 20, 2002 and the time of 18:37 and click on start replay. When you start to see small airplanes all over the screen look in the upper left hand corner. You will see a blue plane along the coast, click on it until it becomes red. Now you will be able to track it's decent into LAX. Big thumbs up
This flight, NWA906 from ANC to KLAX made a rather unusual approach to the 25 complex. Most of the time aircraft arriving from the north depart the Santa Monica VOR at a heading of 070 and fly a righthanded approach pattern. But to my surprise while taking pictures on the northside of 25R I heard a noise overhead, you guessed it, it was NWA906 just a little bit northeast of the 25's at about 5000 feet heading southeast and descending into a lefthanded pattern, quite unusual.
Anyway, It was some excitement for me and now I can relive the path it took as well as you! Laugh out loud
Paul

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Photo © Paul Paulsen

 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 1:13 pm

Paul---

You said that the summer brings smog. Smog, rain, snow, wind, locust attacks... you better keep those amazing photos coming!!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 9:40 pm

Hey Paul, that website rocks Big grin
I've seen that happen more than once. I saw a Lufthansa 747-400 do that from the observation deck...I even followed it with the binos' and saw him go out over seal beach and make the left 180 back towards 25L  Smile
Most of the time, the aircraft are told to depart Santa Monica heading 070, and to cross it at 7000 but descend to 2500 afterwards.
The flight-traker thingy is great to give people an idea of the traffic at LAX  Smile
-Clov
 
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 10:31 pm

Thanks Quantas747-438 I'll do my best! Big thumbs up
 
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alphazulu
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RE: Is The Heat On At Lax?

Wed May 29, 2002 10:41 pm

Your right Clovis, down to 2500 until established on the approach. Big thumbs up Has anyone else tried out the flight tracker, and if so what did you think of it? And, is there something like this for European or Asian airports? If so please let us know!
Paul

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