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JakTrax
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New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:21 pm

Hi all,

Have dropped from a limit of 25 to 20 in the last half-hour or so. I guess the new queue limits have been applied?

Good for our newer members I suppose but seems a bit harsh on those of us who had a decent ratio but not so many shots in the database. Still, if it helps matters I'm all for it, although some advance warning would've been nice.

Karl
 
dazbo5
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:27 pm

Looks like it Karl. If you click on the 'why' on the upload page for number of uploads permitted, it's all there. I can have 40 now without maintaining 90% acceptace ratio!! (not that I did very often).

Darren
 
NIKV69
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:35 pm



Quote:
Good for our newer members I suppose but seems a bit harsh on those of us who had a decent ratio but not so many shots in the database. Still, if it helps matters I'm all for it, although some advance warning would've been nice

 checkmark 

It's a shame that the people that upload high quality shots have to suffer at the behest of people that continue to rant about how they can't get photos accepted here. I don't feel my uploads should suffer now by 5 slots since I take the time to learn PS and get good captures. I usually support this site but I have to say I think they got this one wrong. I think by not using the acceptance ratio as criteria and just using # of pics will only result in more mundane shots being uploaded and less risk taking.
 
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dvincent
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:40 pm

Ah, but for that brief period of time when I had 30 slots a month ago... I've been mostly around 20 slots so I went from 20 to 15. It'll be a long time until I get 500.

That being said I am totally OK with losing some slots in order to make the system a bit more fair/what have you. Let's see how it works!

edit: Nick, if anything, having permanent slots means I won't be afraid to upload stuff I thought was interesting but on the margin before. It certainly lifts a bit of the dampers off.

[Edited 2009-11-05 12:41:55 by dvincent]
 
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clickhappy
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:40 pm

And there you have it. No matter what is done someone will complain.
 
chuck9941
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:41 pm

Didn't realize it would be changing either. My limit was dropped by 2 but I've never maxed out my limit so not much lost. At least this way I might be tempted to try some more creative shots.

Guess we will see soon enough how it affects the queue volume  wideeyed 
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:43 pm

It has plus and minus points Darren. At the moment it's a minus for me but probably a plus for you. At least I can upload what I consider creatives without worrying about my ratio plunging. Was however always a challenge to try and get your ratio as high as possible - built a sense of achievement and I was well on the way to smashing my all-time high! After 1000 shots there's not a great deal to work towards now in my opinion.

I think some advance warning (a few days say?) would've been appropriate so those like me with a decent ratio but under 1000 in the database could've prepared and filled our allocations.

I'm a little disappointed that, of the two most popular options, this one was chosen. I much preferred the idea of having slots 'on the side' (based on 'regular' accpetances) which could be used to try the more 'daring' images without affecting ratios.

Still, we asked for change and we got it. Let's see how this pans out. Initially disappointing for a few I dare say but it could end up being beneficial. I personally think it's a bit generous to those with under 99 shots online.

Karl
 
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Moose135
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:49 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 2):
I think by not using the acceptance ratio as criteria and just using # of pics will only result in more mundane shots being uploaded and less risk taking.

But how many times have you heard people say they don't want to upload a "creative" shot because if it's rejected, it will hurt their acceptance ratio?
 
Silver1SWA
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:58 pm

No complaints here. I never have more than 3 or 4 in the queue at one time anyway. Always afraid of an entire batch getting rejected...   Doing just a couple at a time made me a little more careful.

I was a little shocked though...I need 296 more accepted before I get those 5 slots back. Ouch... Oh well, they were wasted slots anyway. I could lose another 5 slots and it wouldn't affect my uploading habits. But I imagine this will affect many, and they probably wont be happy with the change.

About the old way. I never worried about my ratio having an effect on my slots. I just use it as something to measure my performance. My ratio has improved greatly over the past year and I will still monitor it in the same way I always have.

[Edited 2009-11-05 13:08:02]
 
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dvincent
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:58 pm

I think, overall, it's a good change. The hit that some take (going from 20 to 15 slots, for instance) is minor overall when most people probably stand to gain slots. I might have kerjiggered the transitions a bit more (going from 100 to 500 to 1,000 could have been broken up with two more steps) but overall it's pretty fair I think.

While Nick is right that less risks will be taken, it's because a lot of the "risk" has been removed from the equation. It's much less risky to upload now. So shots that may have been "risky" in the past are no longer risky - you stand to lose nothing by uploading them now, other than some time spent in the queue and a reject email.

That doesn't make what Nick thinks as risky shots any less INTERESTING, though, and without the risk, interesting stuff, even if rejected, will probably increase in the queue. Because in the end, only you control what you upload. Go nuts and submit interesting stuff.

[Edited 2009-11-05 13:00:10 by dvincent]
 
timdegroot
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:00 pm



Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 4):
And there you have it. No matter what is done someone will complain.

 Smile

Tim
 
NIKV69
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:02 pm



Quoting Moose135 (Reply 7):
But how many times have you heard people say they don't want to upload a "creative" shot because if it's rejected, it will hurt their acceptance ratio?

So? There is just as many that won't try other type of shots like night and cabin shots because of this but it's a cop out. If you look at most with low acceptance ratios it's not because they upload creative shots that have a higher risk of rejection it's because they don't pre-screen, don't try to improve their skills and use the autopsy approach by just uploading everything without limiting their uploads to their better captures with good edits. Which is fine but why should others be effected?
 
whisperjet
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:11 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 6):
I think some advance warning (a few days say?) would've been appropriate so those like me with a decent ratio but under 1000 in the database could've prepared and filled our allocations.

Sorry, but that's the worst thing that could have been done. Just imagine everybody tried to fill up his slots within a few days...  Wow!

Stefan
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:28 pm



Quoting Dvincent (Reply 3):
if anything, having permanent slots means I won't be afraid to upload stuff I thought was interesting but on the margin before. It certainly lifts a bit of the dampers off

I agree. At least I can boundary-push now!

Quoting Whisperjet (Reply 12):
Sorry, but that's the worst thing that could have been done. Just imagine everybody tried to fill up his slots within a few days...

I don't know. Those with proven records could've filled their slots if they stood to lose, while newbies would have perhaps held off until the changes. A case of cancelling out. Relative newcomers are certainly going to fill their boots now anyway so a swollen queue is inevitable I think. As a result (for better or worse, I don't know) I doubt there'll be as many images from the older hands in the stack. Again, I think this new system is too generous to newcomers.

I don't think ultimately this will be an unfair system, although it's going to initially hit those with good ratios but with under 1000 images. It's a Robin Hood-type affair - robbing the rich to give to the poor, which I don't entirely agree with but hey...

It gives newbies a chance but to the detriment of the seasoned folks (and I'm not saying I'm a seasoned guy) - my hard-earned slots have been taken away and awarded to someone else.

Whether we'll see a huge queue increase I don't know, and it remains to be seen whether the quality of shots in the queue (not quality of accepted) will take a dive. I'm willing to give this a shot but I really hope it doesn't lead to a dip in quality or a totally out-of-control queue.

Look at it one way - this system works at 'another place' so perhaps best not to be too hasty!

Karl
 
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clickhappy
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:30 pm

Karl - I get the sense you would not agree with us either way.

You are a very vocal, and very minority, opinion.

Keep that in mind.
 
Silver1SWA
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:37 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 13):
Again, I think this new system is too generous to newcomers.

Wait, wait, WAIT a minute here. Wasn't the argument that pushed for this change that the old system was too harsh on the newcomers?!

 banghead 
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:40 pm



Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 14):
You are a very vocal, and very minority, opinion.

Keep that in mind

It has ups and downs - I never said I wouldn't get used to it. In fact I've said several times above that it'd be interesting to see if it pans out okay.

When I lobbied for change I was a voice for quite a few people and stated at the time that, of the two systems discussed, I preferred the other. I also stated that I would go with the flow - which isn't to say that I agreed with it. Most seemed to prefer the revised method activated today, which meant I had to put my own opinions aside.

As for being vocal, I don't see any issue with it unless it's abusive or threatening. I'd like to feel as though I've played a part - however small - in this community.

Karl
 
Stealthz
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:43 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 13):
At least I can boundary-push now!

That is the part that scares me, or at least makes me think it might scare the screeners.

I hope they don't get inundated with thousands of badly lit, poorly composed images under the guise of creativity.

The forum is already full of threads from people that can't or won't take responsibility for their own image making, now that burden will likely shift to the screeners... I hope not.

Remember folks, self screen and be your own harshest critic.. only upload your best.

Having said all that I applaud the move, the team responded to the community, now the community must act responsibly

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 6):
Was however always a challenge to try and get your ratio as high as possible - built a sense of achievement and I was well on the way to smashing my all-time high!

You can continue to see that as a challenge.. and should.

Cheers
 
conoramoia
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:52 pm

Are you guys blind?
It means hat there will be no more moans and groans about borderline images,acceptence ratios AND there will be more variety because we've all seen it were one or two pages have been taken up by a photographer that has decided to upload 25 photos at once of all 737's at an airport in one day!

So in my opinion it was a good idea.

Regards,

Conor
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:00 pm



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 15):
Wasn't the argument that pushed for this change that the old system was too harsh on the newcomers?!

I personally never considered it harsh on newcomers. I know a lot of newcomers (new'camers' actually  Wink ) who've progressed here and whose slots are/were up into double figures. Not that long ago I was new here and if I can manage it without moaning that it's too hard anyone can, as I'm still completely useless with Photoshop.

Making it slightly easier for newbies was an issue brought up a lot and it was a majority thought so when I was a sort of 'spokesman' the other week I had to lobby for it. I didn't however think that to accommodate this we'd have to get tougher on the more experienced folks.

I will say again, I'm a little surprised how quickly it's sprung up, but I'm willing to put my initial impressions aside and see how things develop. I may be quite surprised and I hope I am.

The team seem surprised by some initial moans but surely they knew they weren't going to please everyone in one fell swoop? I urge the community to indeed express first thoughts but to wait to pass final judgement until we see the new system up, running and influencing.

Cheers,

Karl
 
NIKV69
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:01 pm



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 17):
I hope they don't get inundated with thousands of badly lit, poorly composed images under the guise of creativity.

Of course they will, you just threw the acceptance ratio out the window. What do you think is going to happen? Bigger queue with less pre-screened shots.

Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 18):
because we've all seen it were one or two pages have been taken up by a photographer that has decided to upload 25 photos at once of all 737's at an airport in one day!

So what is wrong with that? You forget how this hobby started? If a guy lives near LAS and can't travel what does he do? Not upload?
 
RonS
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:03 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 6):
After 1000 shots there's not a great deal to work towards now in my opinion.

Karl - leaves you less worry about ratio and more time to work on killer shots, right?

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 13):
I agree. At least I can boundary-push now!



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 17):
That is the part that scares me,

Scared of that too..

But, good job by the powers at be that are obviously trying to make changes for the better. Kudos for them for listening to people's issues and doing something.

I would hope that IF the queue time goes from 1 week +/- a day or two to 2-3 weeks, that we would simply re-visit this change to continue to improve the process. I have faith that this would happen.

As of now, for me, I would not worry as much about uploading creative or risky shots and how it impacts my slot allocation. However, I will continue to use pre-screen threads and get other members input / self screen prior to uploading.

And like others have said, just because I have the slots, doesn't mean I'm going to use them.

Thanks guys,

Ron
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:09 pm



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 17):
I hope they don't get inundated with thousands of badly lit, poorly composed images under the guise of creativity

I fear this may happen but we don't yet know. Similar systems work effectively elsewhere. I personally don't mind (too much) a longer queue so long as the quality of acceptances is maintained. Someone can indeed throw loads of poorly-lit images in the queue and clain creative but after so many rejections surely an individual will give up? Or at least reconsider? Let's face it, you still need acceptances to build your slot allocation. Longer queue no doubt but the same quality and perhaps more genuine boundary-pushing shots from new photog's.

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 20):
So what is wrong with that? You forget how this hobby started? If a guy lives near LAS and can't travel what does he do? Not upload?

Not really thought about this a lot but good point, as a friend pointed out last week.
 
conoramoia
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:10 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 20):
So what is wrong with that?

Not so much wrong but it can be very boring to see 20 odd pictures of (example) a ryanair taxing in overcast conditions.

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 20):
You forget how this hobby started?

Certainly not for a.net and to upload 20 odd pics.

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 20):
Of course they will, you just threw the acceptance ratio out the window. What do you think is going to happen? Bigger queue with less pre-screened shots.

Yes, but it just to seconds to reject an images if its that bad.If its borderline I can imagine that screeners would spend an extra minute at it or ask for a second opinion..right?


Regards,

Conor
 
JakTrax
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:18 pm

Quoting RonS (Reply 21):
However, I will continue to use pre-screen threads and get other members input / self screen prior to uploading

More attention paid to the pre- and post-screening threads could effectively prevent the queue from getting insanely long. New folks with newly-awarded slots could be actively encouraged to make full use of the various aspects of the photog forum.

I know this sounds harsh but if an individual with, say, 2 -11 shots accepted starts to abuse the system constantly with bad or misleading images, and this persists, perhaps some sort of polite generic warning can be issued. Too many such warnings and your queue limit is frozen for a certain period of time.

Edit: In fact, slot abolition if someone starts flooding the queue with bad images should cover everyone, irrespective of how many previous acceptances they have.

Karl

[Edited 2009-11-05 14:21:54]
 
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dvincent
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:22 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 22):
Someone can indeed throw loads of poorly-lit images in the queue and clain creative but after so many rejections surely an individual will give up? Or at least reconsider? Let's face it, you still need acceptances to build your slot allocation. Longer queue no doubt but the same quality and perhaps more genuine boundary-pushing shots from new photog's.

Don't forget that, at least to us in the public, we don't know the total allocation of slots and whether or not they shifted up or down. Given that some people had them taken away and others given some, it may wind up being a wash in the end.
 
NIKV69
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:23 pm



Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 23):
Not so much wrong but it can be very boring to see 20 odd pictures of (example) a ryanair taxing in overcast conditions

That shot would probably not get accepted so non issue.

Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 23):
Certainly not for a.net and to upload 20 odd pics

That is not what you said. You said many shots of a 737. You do realize that it was the 50mm side on of different regis of much of the same type that started this hobby? So I don't know what you mean by odd?

Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 23):
Yes, but it just to seconds to reject an images if its that bad.If its borderline I can imagine that screeners would spend an extra minute at it or ask for a second opinion..right?

Either way you have set back all the progress made with screening times. In a bad way.
 
Stealthz
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:25 pm

I am going to go out on a limb here.. whist wearing a flame suit!!

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 24):
More attention paid to the pre- and post-screening threads

More attention learning the craft, more attention to the process both before and after you press the shutter(or hold it down on Hi-Speed sequence!) is the real key.

I fear we are fostering a culture of reliance on the screening threads.

Just .02 worth.. if that!
 
Silver1SWA
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:26 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 16):
As for being vocal, I don't see any issue with it unless it's abusive or threatening. I'd like to feel as though I've played a part - however small - in this community.



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 19):
Making it slightly easier for newbies was an issue brought up a lot and it was a majority thought so when I was a sort of 'spokesman' the other week I had to lobby for it. I didn't however think that to accommodate this we'd have to get tougher on the more experienced folks.

Karl, there is nothing wrong with being vocal. Speaking out is key to making things happen. However we have to be smart about it and stay consistent. We cannot be wishy-washy. Otherwise we will lose the attention of screeners and crew and they will just write us off as bitchers and moaners. Royal's comment shows they already feel that way to a degree. We should be happy they not only listened, but acted. That has been the most important thing for most of us...to be heard!

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 17):
That is the part that scares me, or at least makes me think it might scare the screeners.

I hope they don't get inundated with thousands of badly lit, poorly composed images under the guise of creativity.



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 20):
Bigger queue with less pre-screened shots.

I think the change is really just a re-allocation of slots. While beginners are gaining slots, which allows for the potential spamming of the queue with "junk", a large number of people particularly in the middle range (in terms of # of photos in the DB) have lost slots. So maybe it will balance out and the queue length will remain where it is.
 
jetmatt777
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:35 pm



Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 23):
Yes, but it just to seconds to reject an images if its that bad.If its borderline I can imagine that screeners would spend an extra minute at it or ask for a second opinion..right?

Some simple arithmetic. Let's say it takes 30 seconds (conservative number) to reject an obviously bad picture. Let's also say by the end of this week the queue will grow by 1,000 obviously bad pictures. Based on it taking a minute to reject two bad pictures (30x2 = 60 sec), we can divide 1,000 by two and conclude it will take an extra 500 minutes of time to reject all of those bad pictures - an extra 8.34 hours. Now, those numbers are very generous, I am sure it takes longer than 30 seconds per each bad photo, and as well there will probably more than 1,000 more obviously bad pictures in the queue. The added time will be longer than 8 hours, and that is also assuming 24/7 365 at full speed ahead - Which we all know does not exist. Simple math even shows this will add some time to the queue.

For me, I went up from 2 queue slots to 10. I was at 28% (with 8 of my last 10 accepted on first try), and I was about to step into the 5 slots category (30%+). It does not really feel right for me to have these extra slots as I have not earned them yet. This new system is very socialist and it redistributes the fruits of the hard work of others to those who have not put forth the full effort and will power to improve their images and acceptance ratio. Even though this has affected me positively, I am still against it.

I believe we could have amended the previous system to working from Acceptance Ratio first priority and database numbers second to DB numbers first and acceptance ratio second priority.

We'll see what happens.
 
conoramoia
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:36 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 26):
That is not what you said. You said many shots of a 737. You do realize that it was the 50mm side on of different regis of much of the same type that started this hobby? So I don't know what you mean by odd?

I understand how it started, but what I said was that it wasn't started purely for uploading some 20 pics of the same type of plane,airline,location(etc.)
My point is that I'd prefer to see more variety.

Please don't take what I'm saying personally, But either way A.net's upload queue would still be long so therefore theres isn't that much to complain about!
I mean whats wrong with losing a couple of upload slots?.....I understand that maybe people are slightly annoyed because some slots were gone in an instant..but still....


Regards,

Conor
 
JakTrax
Topic Author
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:41 pm



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 28):
So maybe it will balance out and the queue length will remain where it is

Yes, good point. I hope however that we won't see a dramatic increase in bad shots clogging up the queue. If 70% of the queue can be instantly disregarded surely the team will find themselves spending too much time picking out admissible images? Too much wasted time if only a small percentage of images are admissible.

To be honest I hope I don't fall into the trap of uploading just anything, although hopefully I have enough experience here to know when a shot simply has no chance of working! Or at least I hope I have that sense.....  crossfingers 

Karl
 
cpd
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:56 pm

I'm not really bothered by the new limits. I've gained a few slots - but I rarely upload any more than 3 or 4 images at a time. So I won't make use of the extra slots I get.  Smile

I just hope there won't be a flood of images that slows down the screening process.
 
chuck9941
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Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:58 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:33 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 31):
To be honest I hope I don't fall into the trap of uploading just anything, although hopefully I have enough experience here to know when a shot simply has no chance of working!

Now I'm going to go out on a limb here... at least with my thinking if I have a bunch or new upload slots and am working to increase my photos in the database and improve as a photographer do I really want to upload a bunch of shots just because I can? But lets think about it, if all those shots are grouped together in the queue and the same screener takes a look at them and lets say that 6 out of 10 are instant junk but 3 out of the 4 left might be going on borderline. What are the chances that those possible borderline pics might make it to the second round of screening if everything before has been junk? Everything is subjective and I'm pretty sure a borderline shot will look a lot worse when grouped with a bunch of bad shots that if it were grouped with 6 shots that are auto adds. Its just the way the mind perceives things, human nature, and in no way playing favorites as some would might argue the example to be.

And if a pattern of a ton of bad uploads is found to consistently come from someone where do you think benefit of the doubt will fall on that borderline shot?
 
cpd
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RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:41 pm

I don't know about that scenario. I've uploaded 4 at a time and usually 3 of them get through provided I've done a reasonable job of the photo and processing. Now I'm not entirely like a machine, I do make errors occasionally.

If the image is okay, it'll get through in my experience. They don't tend to say, oh, the other image was bad, so we'll reject the other good ones - just for good measure.

Sometimes, I'll have images accepted that I didn't expect to get through. You can be surprised sometimes.

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 2):
I don't feel my uploads should suffer now by 5 slots since I take the time to learn PS and get good captures.

Just live with it, like everyone else does. It's the rules. If you don't like the site, you can go elsewhere - nobody is forcing you to upload your images here.  Wink You are mentioning a lot of "I" things there. This isn't a democracy.  Wink

[Edited 2009-11-05 15:47:19 by cpd]
 
RonS
Posts: 727
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:22 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 12:11 am



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 28):
Karl, there is nothing wrong with being vocal. Speaking out is key to making things happen. However we have to be smart about it and stay consistent. We cannot be wishy-washy. Otherwise we will lose the attention of screeners and crew and they will just write us off as bitchers and moaners. Royal's comment shows they already feel that way to a degree. We should be happy they not only listened, but acted. That has been the most important thing for most of us...to be heard!

Ahh, Ryan...the voice of reason.

Just chill out and relax. Give the change some time and see how it goes.

Ron
 
locsta
Posts: 288
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 9:53 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 4:26 am

i just filled all my slots with blurry, backlit side-on's with the noses cut off  bigthumbsup 
Can't wait for them to be rejected so I can do it again!

Seriously though, if the worst thing that happens is people can't card dump as much and the queue slows down a bit, whats wrong with that? At least maybe photos that do make it will start getting viewed again.
Besides, It's not like we're the ones who have to wade through all these crappy images that will supposedly flood the queue.

I definitely think this will help give people the peace of mind to upload more"risky" shots. If the downside is the screeners have to look at a bunch more below average photos I am willing to live with that. Big grin

Cheers,

Kevin
 
GPHOTO
Posts: 799
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 11:44 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:42 am



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 24):
I know this sounds harsh but if an individual with, say, 2 -11 shots accepted starts to abuse the system constantly with bad or misleading images, and this persists, perhaps some sort of polite generic warning can be issued.

Karl,

The team have ways of dealing with persistant abusers and are capable of telling the difference between those who abuse the system and those without malice, but whose ambition outstrips their current abilities. I hope that helps put your mind to rest on that one!

I think most of the Screeners time goes on those shots where they are not obviously poor nor obviously fantastic but somewhere in the middle. The ok shots, the 'should-we-shouldn't-we-accept shots'. Combine that level of 'acceptable' quality images with uploaders who are regular contributors and that is where a big chunk of time might be going. As an ordinary and regular contributor, that means it is people like myself who are, collectively, probably responsible for a lot of Screener time being used. But I don't think they are too concerned about that - it's the job!

Best regards,

Jim
 
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Bruce
Posts: 4949
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 2:46 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:45 am

I dont really have any complaint with it but how does it differ now than before? What were the old limits?

Bruce
 
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NZ107
Posts: 4946
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:51 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:10 am

I must say this new uploading system is different.. But the limit might just be to stop people from racking up plenty of rejections. That's my feeling anyway.. Mine just got increased.. And if I get another one up, it'll increase again.
 
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Fly-K
Posts: 3012
Joined: Thu May 04, 2000 4:26 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:14 am

For me personally, no complaints, I always have a limit of 40 now, whereas it would drop to 35 or even 30 when my acceptance ratio went down. Now I can even become more creative without that risk  Smile
 
raedervision
Posts: 63
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:24 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:58 am

The nice thing about change is you can change back if it doesn't work. I don't know what my acceptance ratio is and I don't even care. I push on the inside of the box and figure if I don't get a rejection now and then I'm not trying hard enough to get some interesting photographs on here. The people who want to upload interesting and creative shots need to make sure they follow good photographic and technical standards so the screeners don't start pulling their hair out. Photographs that are borderline should be submitted sparingly so a photographer can develope a feel for what will fly and what won't. I have uploaded a couple I thought had no chance in a million but here they are. I am better for it and hope you are too. Jim
 
zbot69
Posts: 151
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 10:29 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:31 am



Quoting Conoramoia (Reply 18):
Are you guys blind?

Hey Conor... was that some underhanded comment about my photos? Ha ha ha....

Wow... talk about hacking through a Gordian Knot... nice going guys. I'm reading some of these complaints... they don't seem particularly well thought out. Neither were the alternatives that were suggested. Neither were the suggestions that A.net "do nothing."

If you carefully consider all the variables, and there are many, you must conclude this is the best option. I've always looked at this issue from the point of view of Incentives. This solution actually resolves a multitude of problems at once, without any additional bureaucracy. No better yet... A.net has actually simplified the upload process. And that's supposed to be a bad thing? This completely escapes me....

There may be room to tweak the upload limits depending on any major shifts in upload behavior, but that's minor tweaking compared to what you guys just did. Good going!

And once again... thanks to all the guys who offered their time and input in the prescreening thread!

Cheers all!
 
NIKV69
Posts: 14574
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 12:22 pm



Quoting Cpd (Reply 34):
Just live with it, like everyone else does. It's the rules. If you don't like the site, you can go elsewhere - nobody is forcing you to upload your images here. You are mentioning a lot of "I" things there. This isn't a democracy

How original but the fact remains that photogs that worked hard to upload quality pics just got screwed for the sake of those who don't. I still am shocked the site caved into the whining. Really shocked.

Quoting LOCsta (Reply 36):

I definitely think this will help give people the peace of mind to upload more"risky" shots.

In essence those "risky shots" need just as much thought to quality and editing as a side on does. So really all it has done is given people free reign not too.
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 12:31 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 43):
I still am shocked the site caved into the whining. Really shocked.

It shows if anything that the site actually does listen to concerns of the people that make the site what it is.

I can't see what difference it'll make. Less slots or not, people have different ideas on what they think are acceptable and what aren't. Limits will do stuff all for that.
 
Psych
Posts: 3013
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:17 am

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:10 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 43):
I still am shocked the site caved into the whining.

Nik - I am starting to resent the use of language here - 'whining' really does have pejorative connotations.

I will hold my hand up and say that I was one who argued the case against the acceptance ratio as a 'motivator' for pushing boundaries. Not so much for myself (though I cannot deny I prided myself on a high acceptance ratio and hated - and always will - getting rejections) but because I know of a significant number of people who clearly have their behaviour negatively impacted as a result of the ratio. By this I mean they end up being motivated only to upload 'safe' images to 'protect' the ratio - and so not lose upload slots. Not an ideal position for the site in a growing 'marketplace'.

I fully understand the arguments in favour of the ratio and its impact on upload slots. For me I believe we found ourselves in a situation where the 'cons' of the system were starting to outweigh the 'pros' as far as where the site wants to develop. Surely this change of emphasis suggests to all clear thinkers that enough of the 'powers that be' also agreed with this argument to look at a change. They didn't simply 'cave in' to pressure. My years as a member here have not indicated to me that the site are quick to acquiesce to the least little provocation!

This does not mean that the new system is now cast in stone for ever. If this change results in the queue ballooning out of control with even more masses of poor quality images I am sure the site hierarchy will not be afraid to look at the process again. But I - for one - am very reassured to see the site taking account of its membership (not all admittedly - but a sizable number) and looking to make changes.

No decision that was going to be made would please everyone. If this change supports good quality photographers feeling more confident to upload different shots then it gets my full support.

Cheers.

Paul
 
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Granite
Posts: 5029
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 5:55 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:11 pm

Chris

Excellent post.

Regards

Gary

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 17):
Quoting JakTrax (Reply 13):
At least I can boundary-push now!

That is the part that scares me, or at least makes me think it might scare the screeners.

I hope they don't get inundated with thousands of badly lit, poorly composed images under the guise of creativity.

The forum is already full of threads from people that can't or won't take responsibility for their own image making, now that burden will likely shift to the screeners... I hope not.

Remember folks, self screen and be your own harshest critic.. only upload your best.

Having said all that I applaud the move, the team responded to the community, now the community must act responsibly

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 6):
Was however always a challenge to try and get your ratio as high as possible - built a sense of achievement and I was well on the way to smashing my all-time high!

You can continue to see that as a challenge.. and should.

 
dendrobatid
Posts: 1647
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:40 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:36 pm



Quoting Psych (Reply 45):
Nik - I am starting to resent the use of language here - 'whining' really does have pejorative connotations.

Nice response from Paul too !

One facility that we have, one that we seldom use, is to warn or even ban someone who consistently submits images that are considerably below our standards. Before anyone jumps down my throat, this is NEVER used for someone who is trying but even continually missing the mark even by quite a long way. It is however used when we get repeated submissions of images that are considerably below standards and where it is evident that the uploader has not even taken the trouble to check our standards out, the mobile phone shots of distant specks etc. I have often wished that we could share some of these images but it would be grossly unfair to do so, though they often have to be seen to be believed.

I hope that the removal of the acceptance rates does lead to more varied submissions, but that does not mean that we are going to accept them all, but it does leave us with more options.

If my memory serves me correctly, we have simply returned to about the upload limits that were in force before the acceptance rates came into play.

Mick Bajcar
 
viv
Posts: 2953
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 5:17 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:43 pm

Please', let us give the new system a chance before rushing to judgement.

Personally, I think it will be an improvement.
 
RonS
Posts: 727
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:22 pm

RE: New Queue Limit Now In Force?

Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:51 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 48):
Please', let us give the new system a chance before rushing to judgement.

Another voice of reason. Ditto!

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