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dendrobatid
Topic Author
Posts: 1647
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:40 pm

Hit And Vote Cheating

Mon Dec 08, 2014 7:09 pm

A user of this site has recently been soliciting for members to what he laughably termed an a.net voting team. This is a Facebook group to cheat by encouraging contributors to a.net to join his clique and vote for other members of his 'voting team,' to add hits and to influence Photographers Choice.

This is a childish, dishonourable trick and the person sent out the messages, added people to his group and even sent the message to several Screeners, inviting them to join, presumably without realising that they were Screeners. We take a very dim view of his actions and he has received a lengthy upload ban. We are also aware of who the other members of this 'voting team' are and we will be monitoring their actions and if evidence is found of them cheating, the same action is likely to be taken against them. We expected better of many of the names on his list, though it would seem that he has added many names to his group simply because he sent them an e-mail !

If you are more interested in aircraft than in hits, you may wish to re-consider your membership of this little 'voting team'
- if you are even aware of it.

Mick Bajcar
(on behalf of the Headscreeners)
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12662
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:25 pm

Well that's a damn shame, though not surprising (which is sad).

I just can't believe people are so concerned about getting an A.net Photographers' Choice pick that they would actually go out and solicit votes and/or create a Facebook group!

Why not use that time to shoot more aircraft, rather than creating silly Facebook groups and such? Or go for a walk, or go volunteer at a shelter, or play with your dog, or go watch the sunset, or something?

 
 
topgun3
Posts: 260
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 6:27 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:53 pm

Some people always look for an advantage. Counting hits (or money, facebook friends, property) is just like anything else in life, that is how we keep score. So it is no surprise this practice has popped up again. I love getting hits too...but I have no idea how to make people click on my photos. I don't even pay for helicopter rides just so I can get those desirable overhead air-air shots.
 
gabik001
Posts: 541
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:16 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:05 pm

Well, sometimes it happend... Peoples want to be "on the top" no matter how.
I know worst situation on the "other" web photo database. Some peoples have "priority" in screening queue and their photos are screening without waiting. I'm looking on the dates that the photos were taken and it takes maximum 2 days to get photo in database while the waititng line is almost 3 weeks. Shame.

[Edited 2014-12-08 14:23:20]
 
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beaverhunter
Screener
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 12:40 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 1:55 am

There can be no real satisfaction in "cooking" the books. What does it prove, other to say you are a cheat? Your prize is meaningless.
 
photopilot
Posts: 3101
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 11:16 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 2:02 am

Photographer's Choice.... meh!!!

Hits..... meh!!!

My name on the cheque.....  

All the rest of the cheating for ego.....   
 
gabik001
Posts: 541
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:16 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:29 am

Quoting photopilot (Reply 5):
All the rest of the cheating for ego.....

Nothing else to say. You hit 10!
 
310815
Posts: 1039
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:03 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 7:56 am

Quoting beaverhunter (Reply 4):
There can be no real satisfaction in "cooking" the books. What does it prove, other to say you are a cheat? Your prize is meaningless.

Exactly, I think this is what some people don't get.

Quoting topgun3 (Reply 2):
So it is no surprise this practice has popped up again.

Does not suprise me neither, a year and a half a go 2 fellow photographers drew up my attention as I realised that every shot they uploaded was getting at least 2.000 views and hitting the frontpage, even if it was a Norwegian 737 or some other regular shot of well covered spotting locations. I don't know how they did it, but they really overdid it.
But obviously Airliners.net were taken actions as they haven't added a shot of them for over a year now. As long as those cheats get caught and they recive a lengthy upload ban, everything is fine.
 
ckw
Posts: 4586
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2010 12:26 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:14 pm

I've always thought it was a mistake to have views visible.

What good can it acheive? Those who seem to make the most useful/interesting contribution mostly seem to say they don't care anyway, and hits does seem to cause a lot of contention among others.

I suppose in the early days, a little friendly competition between like minded individuals was a bit of fun, but those days are long gone and the figures are so distorted as to be meaningless.

A count could still be kept, but perhaps only available to the pic owner (maybe as a 1st class feature), so they can see how they're doing.

If someone cares enough about an image, they can leave a comment, which I think has a lot more meaning than a "click".

Cheers,

Colin

[Edited 2014-12-09 04:14:37]
 
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ghajdufi
Posts: 460
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2005 5:18 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:32 pm

Quoting JKPhotos (Reply 7):
a year and a half a go 2 fellow photographers drew up my attention as I realised that every shot they uploaded was getting at least 2.000 views and hitting the frontpage, even if it was a Norwegian 737 or some other regular shot of well covered spotting locations.

If that is considered cheating than a very very high number of regular contributors could be banned.
 
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trevisan26
Posts: 440
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 3:31 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 1:38 pm

One or two months ago something that caught my attention was one photo, in the last 30 added at the moment, reach the front page with more than 4000 hits, in less than one hour. If the photo was a new scheme or airline, ok, but it was a regular side photo. I remember what photo was.

(I know the photo was added in less than one hour because in the computer site it shows 3 hits, and in the mobile site more than 4000).

Its nice to get views or even a PC, but when they are cheating it don't have any value in my opinion.
 
310815
Posts: 1039
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:03 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:42 pm

Quoting ghajdufi (Reply 9):
If that is considered cheating than a very very high number of regular contributors could be banned.

You got me wrong ,Gabor. I don't see anyone getting constant frontpage exposure with rather ordinary shots.

I know a few guys that seem to hit the frontpage with every shot they upload, but they upload only special shots. There is a big difference. Of course if someone does only air-to-air shots for example or he only shots at some hard-te-get military base he will likely have most of his shots on frontpage.
But I was talking about average joe regulalry uploading uplading and constantly reaching thousand views with average shots that normally get 100 views on the first day or so. That is not automatically cheating, but it raises questions.

Personally I don't care too much about the view number, but in the end the question about making the frontpage or not is a question about a receiving plenty of attention and more or less obscurity.
 
AndyEastMids
Posts: 1101
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 10:24 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 12:51 am

Great photos and rare / new subjects naturally rise to the top anyway... Those who feel the need to artificially inflate their photo views obviously aren't taking great photos - that says it all really.
 
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johnr
Posts: 139
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 9:46 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 5:03 am

Many, many great photos don't make it to the front page. To a very large extent the front page is selected by the person who decides which photos get put up on Facebook. I personally don't see a lot of difference between this practice and that described in the opening post.
 
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MUC_Spotter
Posts: 159
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 4:26 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:21 am

Quoting johnr (Reply 13):

or Twitter...
That's what I am thinking about it as well. Exactly my thoughts...   
 
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NZ107
Posts: 4946
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:51 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:37 am

Well the same sort of thing would apply to the social media postings by this site - the top 5 is so heavily influenced by the postings that petty things like this for PC voting doesn't really matter/count for much anymore.. A few years ago, I treasured each time I reached the front page on my own merit. Now it just takes either my photo or someone else's to be published on the A.Net FB page and for the majority of pictures, the extra exposure from FB has pushed a particular picture above one that may have had more merit; if the pictures were left to compete without any external factors. Of course there are photographer groups on FB but they have next to no impact compared to a post by the A.Net FB team.

The power (or otherwise) of social media has had a profound impact on 'ordinary photo' views.. You only have to take a look at the top images of 24 hours below the 5 on the front page to see this.
 
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trevisan26
Posts: 440
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 3:31 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:17 am

Why we just don't set a rule to facebook/twitter publications, unless its something new that will appear on the banner, no photos will be posted in social media in the first 24h at database.
 
topgun3
Posts: 260
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 6:27 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 2:28 pm

This topic creates an interesting question in my mind....does higher hits per photo translate to more photo sales? I know this would be hard to track, since A.net has no idea how many photos get sold...but maybe that is part of the motivation as well.
 
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hrtsfldhomeboy
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 1:37 am

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:01 pm

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 15):

Well the same sort of thing would apply to the social media postings by this site - the top 5 is so heavily influenced by the postings that petty things like this for PC voting doesn't really matter/count for much anymore.. A few years ago, I treasured each time I reached the front page on my own merit. Now it just takes either my photo or someone else's to be published on the A.Net FB page and for the majority of pictures, the extra exposure from FB has pushed a particular picture above one that may have had more merit; if the pictures were left to compete without any external factors. Of course there are photographer groups on FB but they have next to no impact compared to a post by the A.Net FB team.

The power (or otherwise) of social media has had a profound impact on 'ordinary photo' views.. You only have to take a look at the top images of 24 hours below the 5 on the front page to see this.

THIS.

This thread is nothing but Pot calling Kettle Black.
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12662
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:02 pm

Quoting johnr (Reply 13):
Quoting MUC_Spotter (Reply 14):
Quoting NZ107 (Reply 15):

You know, I have to admit, you guys have a good point.

As silly as I still find it, it is quite similar to the "official" Facebook postings by A.net.

Quoting trevisan26 (Reply 16):
Why we just don't set a rule to facebook/twitter publications, unless its something new that will appear on the banner, no photos will be posted in social media in the first 24h at database.

They tried that once before. It didn't last long.
 
len90
Posts: 1174
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 1:03 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 8:49 pm

So then why don't we come up with a system where we feature many different photographers work on FB. This way everyone can have some sort of representation and there can be more than just a few familiar names work showing up?

I for one have not been promoted on fb or any social media and had a few pictures that could have skyrocketed in views. However, I am not on here for that. I am on here to share my passion of photography and have my work represented/cataloged on the database.
 
dendrobatid
Topic Author
Posts: 1647
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:40 pm

RE: Hit And Vote Cheating

Wed Dec 10, 2014 10:14 pm

I do not use/understand/visit Facebook but I am aware that that has been discussed to death.
There has been one attempt to rig an image today and the image was removed and the Photographer informed (and he was very understanding about it).

The message that was sent out was this and it is rigging of Photographers Choice :-
"Hello

I saw a screen shots to Airliners net)
Nice pictures. congratulations

I see you too uploading photos!

Like a common, long-term cooperation in the future, I look forward to the another time like.
In return, I will also like to the give you charged your image. And a vote to the (Photographers Choice Award)

So help each other to higher viewing and increasing popularity.

If you send me the link of the photo message (Facebook) then I I of things to do. I give my votes, like or comment.

If I have my photos, I send my you to the link, and look forward (votes like)"

You have all been informed and I am now going to lock this thread

Mick Bajcar

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