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Estate Auction Find
I am in hopes you all can point me in the right direction. I recently acquired thousands of Kodak 35mm slides all of which are photos of Planes from Airlines. Most appear to have been taken at airports. I believe this must have been someones collection at one point. There are too many to mention them all but some of the slides have the ID of the Photographer which include Dean Slaybaugh (150+ Slides with his stamp on them), Phil Brooks, DDM Photos, Jon Proctor, Jerry Stanick, R. J. Hurley, Donald Weber, Don Simmons and many more. There are many ATP Air Transportation Slides as well. I did have to pay a good amount of money for them. I purchased them because first and foremost, I am a Photography collector. I am not sure what is good in terms of the slides and what is not. Many are from the 1960's forward. I became a paid member of this site hoping to gain some advise from you all. I can provide photos and more detail, but first I need to know what details you need. I bought them at a recent Auction in New Hampshire.
RE: Estate Auction Find
I think your best bet is selling to collectors - generally what is looked of are technically perfect side - on shots with no obstructions (fences etc) and in good light (sunny). Of course much depends on the rarity of the subject - both aircraft and livery.
Of course many photographers will take a number of essentially identical shots of the same subject, so even if the subject is rare, there may be a number of photos. While it is possible for a slide to make hundreds this is unusual - the average price is much closer to your .99 cents figure. I think if you took the total number you've bought and multiplied by 2 you'd probably be close to the dollar value of the collection.
You may of course be able to sell some items to publishers, but then your problem is making them aware which means scanning and probably a web site.
Probably your best bet is to visit a specialist slide convention.
Cheers,
Colin
Of course many photographers will take a number of essentially identical shots of the same subject, so even if the subject is rare, there may be a number of photos. While it is possible for a slide to make hundreds this is unusual - the average price is much closer to your .99 cents figure. I think if you took the total number you've bought and multiplied by 2 you'd probably be close to the dollar value of the collection.
You may of course be able to sell some items to publishers, but then your problem is making them aware which means scanning and probably a web site.
Probably your best bet is to visit a specialist slide convention.
Cheers,
Colin
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- clickhappy
- Posts: 9175
- Joined:
RE: Estate Auction Find
Obviously the rarer the slide the more money it will sell for. For instance, an early 707 slide of a plane written off in the 50s-60s will fetch a fair amount, so will a short-lived combo like a United L-1011.
If you want to browse some active auctions try http://www.airlinehobby.com/ or http://www.auctiontransportation.com/
If you want to browse some active auctions try http://www.airlinehobby.com/ or http://www.auctiontransportation.com/
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting ckw (Reply 3): |
Thank you Colin. The slides I have reviewed are in depth in the areas you mention, location, unobstructed views, and sunny. It's funny you mention this because I find photos which are random more interesting...where there are many things going on. This is the collector in me coming out and what I look for in a photo. I have thousands of other photos here which I can spend hours researching, and have. This particular group consists of all Airline Planes in various states, at the terminal, Taxi, Landing, taking off, and even in flight. Someone took great care in identifying each slide on the front. I get excited when I find information like this on a slide because it allows me to do more research. There have been many occasions I find an address written on a slide from the 50's or 60's and the photo is of a house. I Google Street view the address and it come back as the same house. When this happens, I pay it forward by dropping the photos in an envelope and sending it to said address as current resident. Have yet to here any reply, but I would like to think someone is happy to receive them. For me it is more about the research. If I make a couple extra bucks along the way to further my habit, well that is a bonus.
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting AVISLIDES (Reply 5): The slides I have reviewed are in depth in the areas you mention, location, unobstructed views, and sunny. It's funny you mention this because I find photos which are random more interesting...where there are many things going on. |
This is true, but collectors have their own set of ideas about what's worth collecting - they're not necessarily looking at the slide as a photograph. Another important thing is to have the aircraft registration visible, which may not be possible in a more creative or action shot.
Cheers,
Colin
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting clickhappy (Reply 4): |
A bit Off topic, but once these slides are sold from the seller to te buyer, does the buyer assume the full rights to the photo?
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- clickhappy
- Posts: 9175
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RE: Estate Auction Find
I'm not a copyright lawyer but my understanding is, unless specifically agreed upon by the seller, the copyright belongs to the person who created the image.
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting clickhappy (Reply 8): |
It is my understanding the from a commercial use standpoint, The photographer has the rights to the image unless they are passed by them. When I sell a photo. (I have sold them for many years) I am selling the physical photo in my possession which I own and have the right to sell. I do not have the right to use the image in that photo for a commercial purpose. If I were to buy a book, I could resell the book...but I can not republish the story as my own.
RE: Estate Auction Find
That's pretty much my understanding - you have rights of ownership over the physical object, but not over the intellectual property (ie the image itself). But with older materials there is a question of copyright duration. In the USA this is particularly complex because of significant changes to the law, and the fact that at one time registration of copyright was a requirement.
As I understand it a photograph taken prior to 1964 may now be out of copyright if
a) it was not published
b) a copyright renewal was not filed before 1992
I would think this would put a lot of private collections from the early 60s effectively in the public domain - prior to 1978 copyright only lasted 28 years (unless renewed). An act in 1992 auto renewed copyrights for any work that had not already expired, leaving open the possibility of expiration for works created in 1964 or earlier.
Note the above is specific to the USA.
Should add - if you buy a copyright expired image, you do not get copyright - the image is in the public domain. No one has the the copyright.
Cheers,
Colin
[Edited 2015-02-20 01:27:07]
As I understand it a photograph taken prior to 1964 may now be out of copyright if
a) it was not published
b) a copyright renewal was not filed before 1992
I would think this would put a lot of private collections from the early 60s effectively in the public domain - prior to 1978 copyright only lasted 28 years (unless renewed). An act in 1992 auto renewed copyrights for any work that had not already expired, leaving open the possibility of expiration for works created in 1964 or earlier.
Note the above is specific to the USA.
Should add - if you buy a copyright expired image, you do not get copyright - the image is in the public domain. No one has the the copyright.
Cheers,
Colin
[Edited 2015-02-20 01:27:07]
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting ckw (Reply 10): |
well said Colin, I was not aware of how the copyright law had changed. I did however know I had the right to sell the photo I owned. Having said that, I get more value in the research of any image I come across. if I discover something new I did not previously know about through an image, it's a huge win for me. This is a hobby for me, I sell to fuel my passion
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- iamlucky13
- Posts: 1522
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RE: Estate Auction Find
First of all, if you wish to resell a copyright protected article, meaning the specific article you bought (such as slides or prints you bought, but not additional copies you made of that article), the first sale doctrine should apply, meaning it is ok to do that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine
You are also allowed to make copies of works that you bought for archival purposes and personal use (for example, a scan for your viewing and showing privately on your computer) under the fair use principal. Based on a modern ruling that creating thumbnails of copyrighted images online generally falls under fair use (although you might be crossing a line if you don't give credit to the original source), in my amateur opinion, low resolution scans to show online the basic nature of what the photos are should qualify as far use. That arguably does not extend to the size requirements of airliners.net photo submissions.
There may also eventually be allowance to sell copies of the work, such as a print, if you can determine it is an abandoned copyright (unlikely in the days before the Creative Commons and similar licenses), or by treating it as an orphaned work.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orphan_works_in_the_United_States
As the wikipedia article details, there have been attempts to officially legitimize use of orphaned works, but this has not happened yet. So use of orphaned works is not officially in the clear at this time.
That is really cool. I know I'd be ecstatic if somebody sent me old photos out of the blue of a place that has significance to me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine
You are also allowed to make copies of works that you bought for archival purposes and personal use (for example, a scan for your viewing and showing privately on your computer) under the fair use principal. Based on a modern ruling that creating thumbnails of copyrighted images online generally falls under fair use (although you might be crossing a line if you don't give credit to the original source), in my amateur opinion, low resolution scans to show online the basic nature of what the photos are should qualify as far use. That arguably does not extend to the size requirements of airliners.net photo submissions.
There may also eventually be allowance to sell copies of the work, such as a print, if you can determine it is an abandoned copyright (unlikely in the days before the Creative Commons and similar licenses), or by treating it as an orphaned work.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orphan_works_in_the_United_States
As the wikipedia article details, there have been attempts to officially legitimize use of orphaned works, but this has not happened yet. So use of orphaned works is not officially in the clear at this time.
| Quoting AVISLIDES (Reply 5): There have been many occasions I find an address written on a slide from the 50's or 60's and the photo is of a house. I Google Street view the address and it come back as the same house. When this happens, I pay it forward by dropping the photos in an envelope and sending it to said address as current resident. Have yet to here any reply, but I would like to think someone is happy to receive them. For me it is more about the research. |
That is really cool. I know I'd be ecstatic if somebody sent me old photos out of the blue of a place that has significance to me.
RE: Estate Auction Find
| Quoting iamlucky13 (Reply 12): |
| Quoting iamlucky13 (Reply 12): First of all, if you wish to resell a copyright protected article, meaning the specific article you bought (such as slides or prints you bought, but not additional copies you made of that article), the first sale doctrine should apply, meaning it is ok to do that. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-s...trine |
Thanks for the Information. It is a wonder how we made it this far in America with all of these rules and regulations....it can get a bit mind-numbing.
RE: Estate Auction Find
Received more information about this slide collection. The Collectors name was Richard Teehan and he was a flight scheduler for United and Continental for 17 years. Passed away in 2012. Apparently his collection was very extensive and these slides I purchased were only a small portion.
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