I don't know how many people have heard, but the Red Cross has stated that not all of the 557million or so they received in donations for the Sept. 11th Tragedy will not be going twords the victoms and familys and such. Apparently, amoungst other things, the Red Cross has decidedthey got too much money, and are nor going to upgrade there tellecommunications system. Thank God, cause there phone lines were just horrendous right??? The Red Cross said they think the people will understand. Bull-F'in-Shit. I gave my donation through Howard Stern, which inturn gave that money to Rudy Guliani's fund, and EVERY dime of that is going twords the victoms and familys. If I gave to the Red Cross to help with the Sept. 11th tragedy, thats damn wll where my money should be going. I donated to help a family of a heroic rescue worker, or an innocent person who died in the collapse. Not to bye the fu*king Red Cross a new telephone. If there is too much money...do something with it like set up scholarships in the names of hte Police and Fire Fighters that have lost there lives trying to save others. ensure the kids left behind with one or no parents have maney in the bank, to pay for college, even if they are only 5 years old. Maybe its just me, but this pisses me off beyond belief. I will never give the Red Cross a DIME again!!!

KROC:
I agree!
The Red Cross is just a place for politicians wives to be figure heads so they can run for President or Senate seats.

  Ooops did I say Liddy Dole?

Much the way the NYS Senate seat has become a place for a politicians wife to start a run for the presidency...

Yep!

That God Damn Liberal Red Cross!  

That God Damn Liberal New York!  

Actually, I am surprised it took this long for someone to figure that one out. With all the world feeling sorry and everyone donating money, it was glaringly obvious that there would be way too much money to be sensibly used on the survivors and relatives. I did not donate a single dime, simply because I felt that most likely, the money would never reach its destination and be used for something else. And the families are probably going to sue the hell out of someone (dunno whether airlines or the government or Afghanistan) and become rich after all, even without a single donation.

Besides, the red cross can be quite corrupt. I believe there was a time when the Bavarian head of the German Red Cross took 95% of their revenues for his own private pocket during a few years....

Regards

Ikarus

Testify brodah! Liberal, Conservative, Dem, Rep, this has nothing to do with the RC taking money from one fund that people donated too, and use it for other things, and not even humanitarian stuff, some of it is to upgrade there freakin telephones!!!!!

Although we don't aqree on cars, I do agree with some of your politics. Ms. Dole thought her tenure with the Red Cross would be a nice notch for her candidacy.

Thankfully, that has not been realized.

You missed Bill O'Reilly last night. He was livid! I have never seen him this mad. He was pissed about the same issue you are. He was practically screaming at the poor lady who opposed him.

I thought he was totally right about this. You should tune tonight to his show.

- Neil Harrison

Go O'Reilly Go. I will have to look for his show tonight!

Bill O'Reilly has made it his personal crusade to make sure the money gets to the people who deserve it.

Thats good. We all should. I believe there will be a surpluss of money, and it maybe rather large, but thats were I believe scholaships and such should be set up in victoms names and such.

Here's his site:

http://www.foxnews.com/oreilly/index.html


However, I wouldn't mind seeing the excess funds go to fighting poverty in the USA, or something like that. Just as long as it is not going to pay for somebody's BMW.

If the Red Cross made a plea the the people that donated, and said they wanted to do this or that, then maybe...but using the money to upgrade there F'in telephone's??????? Hell No!

I will never donate money to the Red Cross. It is a shitty organization that loses half the money it gets anyway. Then they pocket another half to "improve" the organization which is bull. After that they do help people and mean well, but I don't think enough of the contributions they receive go to where it is needed. It goes through way too many people with the power skim it and there is no bookkeeping to stop it. I volunteered for them, I saw it all the time. They also make decisions like this that are stupid, people didn't donate to buy them some new phones. All of that money is needed, they are stupid to think they got too much money. There are plenty of other organizations I donate to, but never the Red Cross. Just letting you know that there are much better places to donate your money. I would like to add, that I do donate materials & blood to them, that is handled well. But don't make cash donations, buy what you want to donate then give.

One other thing, if they have so much money why do they keep running ads requesting more to help those in NYC??? Sounds like they need more money to waste.

O'Reilly is a media whore who has made it his business to be viable in the news. He couldn't give a damn about the dead at the WTC, the dead in those planes, the dead from AIDs, the dead in Afghanistan, the dead anywhere. All he gives a shit about are his ratings, and like his gasbag friend Rush Limburger will spout any nonsense to keep them up. If he cares so much about the dead, I hope he had it within him to give a big fat check. But apparently, most of the right wing gas bags (Rush, Ann Coulter, O'Reilly have not exactly been forthcoming with $$).

Frankly, I found the whole lemming mentality of "lets send $$$ to the families of the dead and those brave firefighters" rather bizarre. Most of those firefighters (living or dead) have pretty good life insurance policies for the jobs they are paid to do. There are a gazillion charities in this country who are just as deserving and who's coffers are actually quite dry right now.

Besides, whenever you send a check to any relief organization, a certain percentage of it goes towards administrative costs. Thats how the Money gets to those who need it. Your check doesnt magically fly to those in need.

I believe that O'Reilly is sincere about this. If he was all about ratings and that sort of thing, he would be nonstop Anthrax. He started on this cruisade a long time ago, long before any of the other media organizations picked up on the story.

What I saw on his show last night was not someone who was ratings hungry, rather someone who wanted to do right by the families.

O'Reilly donates a good portion of the money he earns from the Factor gear to charaties supporting the victims of the September 11 events. He just doesn't trumpet it like other people do.

I personally hope he succeeds in his self-appointed mission. Those families need those donated dollars.

- Neil Harrison

The one thing that Jaysit said that I can agree on is that a percentage of monies collected go towards administrative costs. If there wasn't any money in this direction then there wouldn't be any charities. But, for Elizabeth Dole and her so-called charity to use the money that good intentioned people sent to families affected by this tragedy for telephones, well she has got alot of, well you all know what I mean.

Jaysit, people sent in money for the families of people involved here because they(we) just wanted to do something. Anything. I happen to live in New York, but if I lived in say Hawaii, maybe I too would have sent something. Distance from here may have been a factor, some may have come from older folks that physically can't do anything else. You have the right to feel as you do, but grant us the same right, to help when and how we see fit.

Lastly, and this may stir up some other conversation, I hope not. When Elizabeth Dole approved the sale of the Pacific routes from PanAm to United, more than one person I know suspected that she took a payoff then. If she did it then, why not now?

Thanks for listening.

I understand the need for a small part of donations to go twords administrative costs, but people donating money to help victoms are donating for that, not so a large chunk of said money can be used to upgrade a telephone system.

>>When Elizabeth Dole approved the sale of the Pacific
>>routes from PanAm to United, more than one person
>>I know suspected that she took a payoff then. If she
>>did it then, why not now?

I didn't know she was involved in that. Are you sure? Sounds like a bunch of crock.

I thought PA sold them off because they were bleeding cash.

- Neil Harrison

Jaysit; Lay off the bad crack jackass and watch the show frequently. He exposed the CEO of Cantor Fitgerald who organized a website in which people can donate money to. But many never got any $$$$$. Most we're living paycheck to paycheck. The CEO goes from news organization-news organziation and cries for them but yet he doesn't get back to the families on the money. I've known about the Red Cross for quite sometime and their diseptive ways! I donated my $$$$ to the Twin Towers fund set up by the Mayor, United Way, widows and children's fund and Fireman's fund.

Only 1 10th of the money doanted to Red Cross will go to WTC families! Outrageous! The head of that organization has already resigned. Remeber during WW 2 they we're charging soldiers and allied troops for coffee, doughnuts and other foods at that time! They have been deceptive for quite sometime! You should've heard the families who didn't get the money. It's heartbreaking on how families didn't get the $$$ on time to help with the bills. In a good majority of the families there was only 1 bread winner.

Go to

http://foxnews.com/story/0,2933,35830,00.html

for the story on Cantor and it's CEO. He's a real prince alright!

Pilot1113-As a former Pan American employee, I can tell you for certain that Elizabeth Dole was involved. She is the one person that gave final approval for the sale to go through.
Yes, PanAm did need money, and United went for the Pacific not only to expand their route system, but because they also knew that PanAm had been carrying full loads for a long time and figured they could do the same. And before you come back with "How are you sure the people on board were paying for their seats and that those seats weren't comped", when we got on the plane, we were give an in-flight advice list. It had the names of all first class and clipper class pax and
any special notations about pax on the plane no matter what the class. That would include if the ticket were free. Also, if was virtually impossible to use a pass on the NRT flights, could be done once in a while, but not much.

Could you please provide me with some literature, I'm most intregued with this.

I just thought Mrs. Dole was 'just married to Bob.' You'll have to understand my skepticism. It's a little difficult to believe.

To everyone else: did anyone see O'Reilly go off on Arthel? That was just a sample of what it was like yesterday when he went off on the woman from one of the charties.

- Neil Harrison

Before the Red Cross, Elizabeth Dole was the Secretary of Transportation, therefore having the final say and approval of any sales and mergers in the airlines.

>>for Elizabeth Dole and her so-called charity<<

Elizabeth Dole isn't with the Red Cross anyomre.



>>sent to families affected by this tragedy for telephones,<<

About the whole telephone thing, the Red Cross is self supportive (I think) and therefore needs to pay its bills, buy new telephones, etc.. That keeps the Red Cross up and running.

Wouldn't it be something, God forbid that another disaster happens and everyone yells at the Red Cross for not having the proper infastructure to handle the claims and stuff?

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing the Red Cross buy new phones, or anyting else with the money, as long as it helps their operation.

But I believe United Way's CEOs used charity money to pay off their BMWs and Mercedes a few years ago...obviously that is not disaster related.



>>when we got on the plane, we were give an in-flight advice list.<<

That list is used so the FAs know what non-revs to skip during meal service.  

Here's some stuff on Dole:

http://www.politics1.com/dole.htm

She's a veteran in the Cabinet

>>Elizabeth Dole was the Secretary of Transportation,
>>therefore having the final say and approval of any
>>sales and mergers in the airlines.

I didn't know she was the Secretary of Transportation. I thought it was only recently did she decide to become active in politics. I guess that's where I get my skepticism.

Thanks guys!

- Neil Harrison

I Work for the ARC. The Red Cross is always there when you need them. What the hell would you do if they werent there. You certainly couldn't get a transfusion, because they keep the blood supply for the country and make sure its safe. They also provide food for needy families, help people find jobs and are always there to help when there is a flood, fire or disaster. And hwo much money do you think the Red Cross wiill actually take from the fund. some people act like there blowing it all on cheap booze, but thats simply not the case. They barely ever get the finances to do something like update there communications, which really needed to be done, and this is there chance to make the improvements to handle more disasters that may (god forbid) come.

PanAm747-Let's get one thing straight here, you don't know what you are talking about when you said that the in-flight list is to know who to "skip" in the meal service. I do-I am a former PanAm flight Attendant. The in-flight list was used for many things, advice on special meals(kosher,, diabetic, etc.), if a passenger would need special help getting off the plane, not just meals. Ii told us if a pax had been upgraded for some reason,if they had been down graded possibly because they had gotten to the gate late(often we would give comp drinks if they ended up in Economy), just after 103 we had many family members with us and the list would let us know where they were so we could help if needed. Many, many things were included on the in-flight list as you can see. In fact once, I had Gina Lolabridgida on the plane going to FCO, she did get to the gate late and all First Class seats were gone and she had to sit in Clipper Class. The list told us who she was(like we really didn't already know) and where she was sitting(knew that too!).
I realize that Mrs. Dole is no longer with the Red Cross, and I guess that I shouldn't include all people who work with the Red Cross just because of the way she has acted in the past. I don't trust her or what she says. I feel as if she has lied in the past and if given the chance she will do so again. My apologies to those good people who try every day working with the Red Cross. It would have been better or maybe just nicer if the powers that be with the Red Cross had better explained why monies people had donated with the intention of it going to the WTC victims was going to be used somewhere else.
And one more thing PanAm747, the UnitedWay's people using the money like you said,was absolutely disgusting!

>>They barely ever get the finances to do something
>>like update there communications, which really
>>needed to be done, and this is there chance to make
>>the improvements to handle more disasters that may
>>(god forbid) come.

So you steal from the fund that was rightfully meant for the families?

You know what the legal system calls that? "Fraud in the Inducement." You advertised that all the money donated to that fund would go to the families and it's instead being diverted to pay for other things. That's wrong. The money people donated, they didn't donate to you -- they donated it to the families and the Red Cross pilfered for their uses.

- Neil Harrison

 

>>you don't know what you are talking about<<

At least at Delta, the list shows the names of all standby passengers. If they don't have enough meals to give, they look at the list and pick out the nonrevs who will not be getting meals. The list also shows the destination the pax are flying too. I believe every airline has this.

Ex. A fellow employee was flying and an FA came up to him. She said a revenue passenger had a broken entertainment system. She then told the non-rev to switch seats with the revenue passenger.

>>And one more thing PanAm747, the UnitedWay's people using the money like you said,was absolutely disgusting!<<

The current Red Cross "chief" makes $400K a year.

ARE YOU ALL F'ING IDIOTS?

HAVE ANY OF YOU BOTHERED TO CHECK THIS OUT FOR SURE?

I GET FOX NEWS CHANNEL HERE, AND THAT O'REILLY DIPSHIT IS THE ONE YANK THAT PISSES ME OFF BIG TIME. HE IS SO ANALLY RETENTIVE, I WOULD BE SCARED TO KICK HIM UP THE ARSE (LIKE I WOULD LIKE TO) FOR FEAR OF LOSING MY FOOT.

FOX NEWS IS THE WORST NEWS STATION I HAVE EVER HAD THE MISFORTUNE OF SEEING ON MY TV SCREEN. AND I AM ABSOLUTELY LIVID THAT A STATION SUCH AS THIS IS AUSTRALIAN OWNED.

ANYWAY, CHECK IT OUT:

http://www.redcross.org/news/ds/0109wtc/donationwork/myths.html

MYTH

The American Red Cross is spending $109 million on "accounting, database management and telecommunications upgrades."

FACT

The American Red Cross has raised an estimated $540 million in approximately six weeks — a massive amount of money for any organization to process, account for and audit. As good stewards of public funds, we were required to spend funds to improve existing systems and enhance controls over service delivery. Thus far, we have spent $1.7 million to expand our system and to properly process and acknowledge the heavy volume of contributions in accordance with industry standards and tax requirements.

At the same time, we have created two nationwide toll-free hotlines: 1-866-GET INFO for public requests for assistance and 1-877-746-4989 specifically for families who lost loved ones in the September 11 attacks. We have also increased the bandwidth of our public Web site to handle the flood of resulting inquiries. We have spent $800,000 to date on this activity.

----

It is a well known fact that the Red Cross is a NON-PROFIT ORGANISATION. As such they have overheads which have to be met. Anyone who donates to them knows this. Over US$550 million was raised, and the Red Cross is expected to bear the costs of distributing this money themselves?

If every non-for-profit organisation was expected to pay its own expenses, there would be none left.

And then who would be left to distribute funds next time, when Hollywood (if only) is taken out by a terrorist bomb?

So people, wake up and get back to reality!!!!

Excuse all the caps above. I didn't realise they were on, and I wasn't going to re-type it out....busy..busy...busy

~~~ About the whole telephone thing, the Red Cross is self supportive (I think) and therefore needs to pay its bills, buy new telephones, etc.. That keeps the Red Cross up and running. ~~~

True, but the Red Cross receives donations everyday for projects like that. The Red Cross set up a completely different fund...seperate from there normal donation line. People that donated money to that seperate fund donated there because they wanted there money to go to victoms and such in NYC and Washington DC. They can get there administrative costs for having to process the loot and all, but that is it.

The in-flight list at Delta shows exactly the same things as the one PanAm had. A big difference in that at PanAm non-revs got a meal, but if might be from Economy instead of First Class. That was maybe part of their problem(a very small part indeed), in that they fed their standbys. Delta does not(actually if you do some checking, they don't feed anybody much anymore) and the standby list is necessary for that reason. If one of their people is not going to get a meal they do not arbitraily pick a person out, they go by the priority boarding code, and then if necessary to seniority from there.
As far as your friend is concerned, was he told to move or was he asked? Considering that as an employee he had not had to pay for his ticket, do you think he really had reason to be upset?
I didn't realize the Red Cross head made that much! Makes the United Way guys sound not as bad(even though they are). At least we agree on the last part here, right? Have a good day!

KROC-I see your point, but if the Red Cross came up to me and said my money will pay for new phones, I wouldn't get mad. I believe the money is going to help those in need no matter if it is used in NYC or on phones.

Bill O'Reilly rocks!

I respect your opinion PanAm, but it would piss me off, because like I said, they have there normal donation flow, and that money should buy them new phones, not money that was donated to NYC and DC victoms and families. The Red Cross opened a specific fund for these people, and now they are gonna dip into it, and pull the money elsewhere. That is totally wrong.

>>they have there normal donation flow,<<

But what if that isn't big enough?

I just wouldn't like to see something like,

Monetary Support for Domestic Disasters:

1. 9-11: $1 Trillion Dollars
2. Midwest floods which put millions of farmers out of business: $10

Irrelevant. The 9-11 fund did not get 1 trillion dollars. The Mid-West farmers, get much relief EVERY YEAR from the RC. The Red Cross is a non-profit organization, so they must be getting donations everyday. My whole point seems to keep going unnoticed. The RC created a seperate fund for 9-11. Seperate from teh rest of the RC donations. beacause they did that, that meant people KNEW there money was going for 9-11. Now there money is going for a telephone upgrade. Bullshit.

KROC--

Did you not read my last posting? What the RC is doing is called "fraud."

They cannot claim that they're collecting money for one thing, with promises that it will go to that one thing, and then pilfer it to upgrade their infastructure.

The fact is charaties in this country have literally a free reign to do anything with the money, without any government oversight. If the Red Cross decided that money was better spent buying the President a summer home in the Caribbean, then the money would be spent there.

We have a lot of people across this country who literally gave their food money to the families of this tragedy and to hear that it is going to pay for better phones is sickening.

- Neil Harrison

I did read your post Neil, and you said it best. It's sickening.

But how did you know that your Twin Towers money wasn't going to finance "administrative expenses"?

If I gave to the Red Cross, and my money went to the operation of the Sep. 11th fund, then that is acceptable. But if it went to say upgrade a phone system, then that is not okay.

"Administrative expenses" shouldn't cost millions and millions of dollars.

I would say 2 million tops, even then that's putting it out there.

What you really need is a computer system with a database listing all the people who are owed money out of this pot and the total they're owed.

This can be easily accomplished with donated computers and software. Along with the donated time from volunteers. After all most who work for the Red Cross aren't getting paid, or they shouldn't be.

I don't understand how this could total over $1-2 million at the exteme most when most of what the RC gets is for free. Why has it been almost 2 months to give the money to those that deserve it?

- Neil Harrison

Right on Neil. Strange how I have heard nothing of hte disspersal of all that money.....

Is it your job to know?

KROC

People like you HEAR WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR!!!!

There is no getting thru to you is there?

WN, it is my right, if I give them MY money.

Aviatsiya. I have heard everything on this thread. It is my opinion that I am expressing. Are you saying I can not do that? Are you telling me, because we disagree, I am wrong? Get over yourself. It's people like you, that follow the establishment blindly. I have not seen or heard enough proof how the Red Cross really should be talking money form the Sep. 11th fund to use for other things to make it change my opinion.

I don't know, KROC. They never said it was your right. They are a private organization, correct? So like the Boy Scouts can teach racism and intolerence to our youth, the Red Cross can keep from telling you things!

People like ME follow the establishment?????

We're Nuts...sweety.....do me a favour and put our friend KROC here back in his place.