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KarelXWB
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SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:14 pm

Final A350-900ULR cabin config for SQ will be as follows:

- 68x Business Class
- 94x Premium Economy

Seats will be supplied by Zodiac and Jamco.

Via https://twitter.com/A350_Production/sta ... 3877155840
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texl1649
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:19 pm

With respect to zodiac perhaps It would be more accurate to say "seats may eventually be supplied..."
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:23 pm

I see how Airbus plans to get 9700nm of range then.
 
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Irehdna
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:28 pm

Are the seats pictured the ones that will be placed in the A359? I thought SQ would develop all new products (especially business class).
 
infinit
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:32 pm

Keep in mind that this isn't an official announcement..
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:33 pm

Irehdna wrote:
Are the seats pictured the ones that will be placed in the A359? I thought SQ would develop all new products (especially business class).


New product should be announced during summer.
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anshabhi
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:43 pm

that's a very expensive bet from SQ.
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:53 pm

anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

If it doesn't pan out all SQ has to do is rip out some of the seats, add a Y cabin, and use it like a regular A359. One of the reasons why the A350ULR is attractive to them, SQ don't want to be stuck with a dedicated ULR plane with limited resale value like what ended up happening with the A345.
 
QueenoftheSkies
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 1:53 pm

Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.
 
boeing767-300
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:01 pm

I remember the earth being promised with A345 and we know how that turned out. A345s were scrapped and the 77L was more capable.
Maybe the the 778X will prove more capable again especially in terms of payload. Time will tell but airline keep trying the ULR thing..... punters are not so sute
 
knoxibus
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:09 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
I see how Airbus plans to get 9700nm of range then.


I put a bit more though in that.

Compared to a standard SIA A350-900 (42/24/187), and if you account for the below weights (which can be refined), you have:
For standard LR:
42*100kg per seat = 4200kg
42*130kg per pax+luggage = 5460kg
24*30kg per seat = 720kg
24*130kg per pax+luggage = 3120kg
187*11kg per seat = 2057kg
187*100kg per pax+luggage = 18700kg
Total = 34257kg

For ULR:
68*100kg per seat = 6800kg
68*130kg per pax+luggage = 8840kg
94*30kg per seat = 2820kg
94*130 per pax+luggage = 12220kg
Total = 30680kg.

So you have a 4T advantage for the ULR...that you loose due to the increased in catering level for it (catering for a business class is heavier than for an eco class I guess) + associated amenities.

So I don't think there is a major difference between the two in terms of pax load. I do have a fairly good idea about the seat weights (I actually have them but rounded them) but I am ready to be corrected on pax+luggage weight. I think the overall result would still remain in the same range.
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flee
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:11 pm

Polot wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

If it doesn't pan out all SQ has to do is rip out some of the seats, add a Y cabin, and use it like a regular A359. One of the reasons why the A350ULR is attractive to them, SQ don't want to be stuck with a dedicated ULR plane with limited resale value like what ended up happening with the A345.
SQ will only have a small subfleet of A350ULRs - it is a more efficient aircraft and oil prices are much lower than when they operated the A345 on the ULR routes. They also have a two class layout carrying more pax as compared to just 100 business class seats in the A345.

Lets see if they can make it work this time!
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:15 pm

knoxibus wrote:
So you have a 4T advantage for the ULR...that you loose due to the increased in catering level for it (catering for a business class is heavier than for an eco class I guess) + associated amenities.


Most of the payload is lost due to increased fuel capacity.
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rbavfan
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:22 pm

QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.


Yeah but the last time they ended up doing all business class.
 
TheGeordielad
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 2:54 pm

This isn't really a big bet by SIA imo because if it goesnt go to plan they can easily swap some of the seats.
Does anyone know what routes SIA will deploy the aircraft on?
 
BG777300ER
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:01 pm

SIN-JFK/EWR?
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:04 pm

TheGeordielad wrote:
This isn't really a big bet by SIA imo because if it goesnt go to plan they can easily swap some of the seats.
Does anyone know what routes SIA will deploy the aircraft on?


SIN-EWR will certainly be one route with SIN-LAX likely another. They could do both LAX and SFO if they wanted depending on their marketing ideas (billed as a premium flight).
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:08 pm

anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

The reason is simply that an airline cannot sell bargain basement Y fares on a ULH route. The way the numbers pan out, a cheap Y seat sold on a nonstop might not even cover its own flying costs.

For that reason, if projected revenue out of the Y cabin would be lossmaking then unlike the armchair consultants who think the 778X is the cure for everything, SQ have decided not to offer it. Better to go all-premium with a smaller, more fuel efficient aircraft.

The same goes for cargo on a ULH route. The "experts" think the 778X is wonderful because it has cargo lifting ability, but that cargo needs to command a decent premium. SQ is being conservative here by going for a lower capacity that might seem odd at first glance but it's actually quite clever as it stimulates yield and deletes potentially lossmaking payload.
 
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Slug71
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:12 pm

Was the A350-800 with -900 engines ever an option for ULR?
With only a 162 seats, seems like a shorter frame would have made more sense.
 
Flighty
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:19 pm

Channex757 is exactly right. This is an RJ mentality. And it works.
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:20 pm

rbavfan wrote:
QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.


Yeah but the last time they ended up doing all business class.

Didn't they switch to 2-class?
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LAXintl
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:22 pm

Very much look forward to trying the plane out !


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Polot
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:24 pm

ikramerica wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.


Yeah but the last time they ended up doing all business class.

Didn't they switch to 2-class?

It was two class to start (J/PE then called Executive Economy). They later switched to all J. Towards the end there were rumors that SQ was looking at re-adding PE but that never happened with SQ disposing of the fleet instead.
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:30 pm

Channex757 wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

The reason is simply that an airline cannot sell bargain basement Y fares on a ULH route. The way the numbers pan out, a cheap Y seat sold on a nonstop might not even cover its own flying costs.

For that reason, if projected revenue out of the Y cabin would be lossmaking then unlike the armchair consultants who think the 778X is the cure for everything, SQ have decided not to offer it. Better to go all-premium with a smaller, more fuel efficient aircraft.

The same goes for cargo on a ULH route. The "experts" think the 778X is wonderful because it has cargo lifting ability, but that cargo needs to command a decent premium. SQ is being conservative here by going for a lower capacity that might seem odd at first glance but it's actually quite clever as it stimulates yield and deletes potentially lossmaking payload.


I do not quite follow the logic. SINLAX is shorter than DXBAKL. If the problem on hand is low yields in a regular coach cabin, then Emirates should be having a terrible result in the nonstop to AKL.

I believe the key factor for Singapore if it leaves regular Y out of the ULR is payload, not the quality of Y fares. Also Singapore as a company is focused on business travel, so as a matter of strategy it is not so concerned with price sensitive travelers choosing a different airline.
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ap305
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:46 pm

Unless SQ is seeing very poor yields in standard economy, the ulr will likely not see service to sfo. Even the 278t variant available from next year(and assuming SQ takes it) will do away with the need to block seats westbound in winter. The ulr will likely be a very small subfleet that sees service to Lax and the east coast.
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:49 pm

texl1649 wrote:
With respect to zodiac perhaps It would be more accurate to say "seats may eventually be supplied..."

You are spot on the money there, with their back log and customers going to court expect a delay.
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parapente
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 3:59 pm

I don't understand the animosity to what SQ are doing and what Qantas are preparing to do.
This is the first generationof a brand new ultra efficient aircraft.Lighter,with the Words most efficient pair of engines bolted onto a pair of state of the art v high aspect wings.
Oil is stuck at $50 a barrel not twice that price.The only passengers that are missing are the ones that hardly generate any income and there are more of those that do.The ones who (and their company who pays) want to get to their destination as fast as possible in a level of comfort that let's them sleep on the way.
What's not to like other than those who don't happen to want to fly this way and hang around half way at the fuel station.But that's their right if it's what suits them.
The present environment and aircraft is very different to the A345 days!
Are we saying that both SQ and Qantas are total fools?
 
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RL777
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:00 pm

Right about what I expected although maybe a bit on the low side, excited to these get into service.


texl1649 wrote:
With respect to zodiac perhaps It would be more accurate to say "seats may eventually be supplied..."


You sir have just made my day!
 
c933103
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:03 pm

anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

It's not exactly a bet given they have flown the same routes for almost a decade in the past with a less fuel efficient aircraft
 
ZEDZAG
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:05 pm

knoxibus wrote:

So you have a 4T advantage for the ULR...that you loose due to the increased in catering level for it (catering for a business class is heavier than for an eco class I guess) + associated amenities.


Perhaps to note that URL cabin is probably lighter, and with empty belly, so its not just 4T of a difference in payload(passanger payload maybe)

I dont know if there are any numbers on OEW of a standard 359 and this URL. It would be nice if someone could make/post payload/range chart of the two frames.
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:08 pm

QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.

And how much more efficient! The A340 apparently used 222,000l of fuel on the route (per wiki citing a guardian article, I know), versus the A359ulr's capacity of 165,000l. That's 57 tonnes of fuel saved, even if the figures are like for like!

It was broadly the same payload, too. If the OP is correct, the A350 will carry 4 more J than the original A345, but 23 less Y+. The revenue per flight shouldn't fall much, especially since even in the good times load factors were only in the low 70's (dropping to the 50's in the GFC iirc). Of course this assumes the demand is still there, but if so, it's not hard to see how they view these routes as potentially viable again.

Edit: Did the sums on Cabin floor space and it turns out I lied. The A345 is bigger than I thought.
Last edited by BaconButty on Fri May 12, 2017 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Down with that sort of thing!
 
c933103
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:16 pm

Would 9700nm be the range with zero payload?
 
SonOfABeech
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:23 pm

Can't a bog standard A359 do SIN-LAX? Or are the extra 300nms too much?
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 4:55 pm

QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.

You seem to dismiss the efficiency aspect as if it's not important here.
SQ never had a problem filling the plane when they operated the route with an all J A345, so we know that the demand exists for business class. They run into problems when oil rose to $100/bbl. And the fact that the A350 is significantly more efficient and can still carry 50% more passengers should be a slam dunk. On top of that, fuel prices are low and keep dropping.
IMO, I think they have too many premium economy seats and it should have 3 classes instead: J, Y+, and Y.
It was proven the first time around that there wasn't demand for premium economy, thus the switch to an all J config.
If they are putting only 162 seats, they must be thinking about routes much longer than SIN-NYC and SIN-LAX. SIN-GRU perhaps? It's only 400nm longer than SIN-NYC.
 
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 5:01 pm

TheGeordielad wrote:
This isn't really a big bet by SIA imo because if it goesnt go to plan they can easily swap some of the seats.
Does anyone know what routes SIA will deploy the aircraft on?


I imagine they will also use it to SFO replacing a standard A359, as well as EWR and LAX.

I think they have 7 ULRs on order whereas they had only 5 A345s for EWR and LAX (a further 5 A345 options were not taken up).
Last edited by JerseyFlyer on Fri May 12, 2017 5:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
tommy1808
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 5:04 pm

airbazar wrote:
They run into problems when oil rose to $100/bbl. And the fact that the A350 is significantly more efficient and can still carry 50% more passengers should be a slam dunk.


Wasn't it a combination of high fuel price and upcoming heavy maintenance? Kinda the flights itself still did acceptable, but it would never ever be able to recover the heavy check?

Otherwise I agree, they should have a very good understanding of demand and marketable pricing.

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tphuang
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 5:35 pm

I don't know why people argue for the need of an economy class section here. Anyone traveling for business will pay for j class. Any less price sensitive passenger will pay for pe. Any price sensitive passenger can transit with one of the mainland airlines for under $1000. Singapore airlines will never be getting those people anyhow. You can find $2500 j tickets these days on air china from NYC to Singapore. How it Singapore airlines going to charge the kind of y prices that can make margins with that kind of low ceiling.
 
ap305
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 5:36 pm

ZEDZAG wrote:

I dont know if there are any numbers on OEW of a standard 359 and this URL. It would be nice if someone could make/post payload/range chart of the two frames.


~136t was the figure given here for a batch 3 a359...
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c933103
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 6:13 pm

Could they also use these ULRs to launch South America routes? As the distance seems to be similar. However, how much premium traffic would south america - singapore have is really doubtful.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 6:32 pm

Channex757 wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.

The reason is simply that an airline cannot sell bargain basement Y fares on a ULH route. The way the numbers pan out, a cheap Y seat sold on a nonstop might not even cover its own flying costs.

For that reason, if projected revenue out of the Y cabin would be lossmaking then unlike the armchair consultants who think the 778X is the cure for everything, SQ have decided not to offer it. Better to go all-premium with a smaller, more fuel efficient aircraft.

The same goes for cargo on a ULH route. The "experts" think the 778X is wonderful because it has cargo lifting ability, but that cargo needs to command a decent premium. SQ is being conservative here by going for a lower capacity that might seem odd at first glance but it's actually quite clever as it stimulates yield and deletes potentially lossmaking payload.


Flighty wrote:
Channex757 is exactly right. This is an RJ mentality. And it works.


It works if enough people will pay enough of a premium to save ~3 hours and the inconvenience of a connection (and maybe an interruption to their sleep). If your travel is 22 hours door to door on the non-stop, are you willing to make it 25 hours to save $300 ? Then carriers don't need to burn as much fuel just to carry fuel: think 2x 5000sm A330 segments vs. 10,000sm on a 359LR.

SQ's config might work on just a very few routes in the SQ network.
 
MDW22L31C
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 6:35 pm

If SQ starts SIN-LAX will SIN-NRT-LAX and SIN-ICN-LAX be discontinued?
 
c933103
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:03 pm

According to http://www.airlinerpulse.com/blog/2017/ ... ction.html
"Airbus also intends to propose a VVIP version of the A350-900ULR, with even more outstanding performance: 25 passengers, 10,800 NM (20,000km) range of action, 22 hours flight."
So it look like the 9700nm range is not zero payload range.... if SQ's 359ULR have 162 seats and can fly 8700nm, and the VVIP one can fly 10800nm with 25 pax, perhaps 9700nm would have a capacity of somewhere in the middle... about 90 seats which is similar to SQ's 345 in all business class config?
 
airbazar
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:23 pm

JerseyFlyer wrote:
I imagine they will also use it to SFO replacing a standard A359, as well as EWR and LAX.
I think they have 7 ULRs on order whereas they had only 5 A345s for EWR and LAX (a further 5 A345 options were not taken up).

I don't think SFO is a slam dunk. They are doing fine with a standard A359 except in a few Winter months and even then I suspect the standard A359 is the better plane for the market because it gives SQ the ability to transport passengers who are connecting at either end, not just O&D passengers. I think they will keep the A359 on this route until the 779 shows up.
tphuang wrote:
I don't know why people argue for the need of an economy class section here. Anyone traveling for business will pay for j class. Any less price sensitive passenger will pay for pe. Any price sensitive passenger can transit with one of the mainland airlines for under $1000.

The record shows otherwise. They coudn't sell pe before. And price sensitive passengers are not all flying between SFO and SIN. A lot are connecting and if they have to trave a different route then SQ is losing those by the bucket load because it would be a 2 stop route. Y might not be needed from NYC but I'm pretty sure it is needed from the West Coast and the current SFO-SIN proves it. I woud bet that SQ will operate SIN-LAX/SFO with a 779 in a 3-class config with a Y cabin.
 
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par13del
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:29 pm

Is this the same version A350 that DL has a problem with doing its SYD run?
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:36 pm

ikramerica wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
Yeah but the last time they ended up doing all business class.

Didn't they switch to 2-class?

Other way around. They started 2class, and switched to all-J


Polot wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
that's a very expensive bet from SQ.
If it doesn't pan out all SQ has to do is rip out some of the seats, add a Y cabin, and use it like a regular A359. One of the reasons why the A350ULR is attractive to them,

They can use it like one, but the question is to what extent would it actually BE like one.

Contrary to popular belief, the A359 is not just a software update.... there's several physical changes, including: additional piping, additional fuel pumps, modified heating and sensory system within in the wing, modified jettison system, fortified landing gear, heavier brakes, etc.

Some of those can surely be retrofitted out. Others, Airbus has never really made clear if they can be exchanged or "un-modified" or not.

So while none of that stops the aircraft for being used for shorter routes, it still would leave them as oddballs in the fleet, if for even a few hundred lbs extra weight. Particularly as 280T standard A359s become available, in time.


MDW22L31C wrote:
If SQ starts SIN-LAX will SIN-NRT-LAX and SIN-ICN-LAX be discontinued?

They kept SIN-NRT for the duration of the A345's nonstops' existence. And as fewer airlines offer LAX-NRT nowadays (as opposed to HND), maybe they can capture what premium demand exists.

If I had to guess, if they discontinued any, it'll be ICN-LAX, as they'll always be an also-ran to KE/OZ on that route.


c933103 wrote:
Could they also use these ULRs to launch South America routes? As the distance seems to be similar. However, how much premium traffic would south america - singapore have is really doubtful.

SIN-GRU is within the A359ULR's range, and Brazil is slowly bouncing back, so who knows?


SonOfABeech wrote:
Can't a bog standard A359 do SIN-LAX? Or are the extra 300nms too much?

It can if they're willing to block enough seats.

Kinda ironic that they haven't already, considering that the SIN-LAX flight will offer 91 less seats than the current SIN-SFO flights do anyway. Perhaps not enough J seats on the standard A359s to make them worthwhile as a placeholder.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:37 pm

par13del wrote:
Is this the same version A350 that DL has a problem with doing its SYD run?

No
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
Turnhouse1
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Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Fri May 12, 2017 7:39 pm

c933103 wrote:
According to http://www.airlinerpulse.com/blog/2017/ ... ction.html
"Airbus also intends to propose a VVIP version of the A350-900ULR, with even more outstanding performance: 25 passengers, 10,800 NM (20,000km) range of action, 22 hours flight."
So it look like the 9700nm range is not zero payload range.... if SQ's 359ULR have 162 seats and can fly 8700nm, and the VVIP one can fly 10800nm with 25 pax, perhaps 9700nm would have a capacity of somewhere in the middle... about 90 seats which is similar to SQ's 345 in all business class config?


That's interesting, as the Holy Grail of LH flying, LHR-SYD is 9188nm. Unless there is a way to put an A359 fuselage on an A35J wingbox, then that's probably all we're getting this generation.
 
NZ321
Posts: 935
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:05 pm

QueenoftheSkies wrote:
Ultra long haul and only 162? Right like that's gonna work. They are doing the same thing again albeit with a far more efficient aircraft.


Why shouldn't it work? Have you any idea of the income and profile of the market we are talking about? Check out the demographics on Singapore. SQ have other flights to the US which amply serve economy passengers. This aircraft is solely about business and premium travellers. They've done their homework. The 77L and 345 were not the right equipment. This aircraft is niche and will serve that market well.
Plane mad!
 
WIederling
Posts: 6873
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:20 pm

knoxibus wrote:
I think the overall result would still remain in the same range.


4t for 162 PAX is 24.7kg presents "forage" per seat.

That is quite a bit more than "all you can eat"
even when counting the wrapping (trolleys, ... ) too ;-)
Murphy is an optimist
 
Flighty
Posts: 9719
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:07 am

Re: SQ A350-900ULR to feature 162 seats

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:23 pm

tphuang wrote:
I don't know why people argue for the need of an economy class section here. Anyone traveling for business will pay for j class. Any less price sensitive passenger will pay for pe. Any price sensitive passenger can transit with one of the mainland airlines for under $1000. Singapore airlines will never be getting those people anyhow. You can find $2500 j tickets these days on air china from NYC to Singapore. How it Singapore airlines going to charge the kind of y prices that can make margins with that kind of low ceiling.


Singapore has been selling Y seats in its region for many decades. They know that the first 100 Y seats you sell are quite high priced. Maybe bought on short demand. Maybe customers value the nonstop service at $500 additional each way versus a stop.

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