tcfc424
Topic Author
Posts: 531
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 11:56 am

Why Anet Is Declining

Sat May 04, 2019 7:35 am

I joined this site sixteen years ago and was mesmerized by the information that was available here.

I wound up finding a job as a ramper for UA through this site and loved my time there.

I have engaged with many people from different facets of aviation through this site.

I have learned tremendous amounts of information regarding crashes, airline direction, operations and such from this site.

I have seen some of the most amazing aviation photography on this site.

I have always loved that I can leverage my aviation geekiness by showing people that mainstream media quotes Anet.

HOWEVER.

Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)
 
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ajaaron
Posts: 237
Joined: Thu Nov 02, 2000 9:31 am

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sun May 05, 2019 8:55 am

Yes - I posted a few days ago here that my photo was submitted, accepted, but not actually added to database. Was told to submit my photo ID on another thread, which I duly did. Now a few days on, photo still not added. Wondering if anyone is actually seeing my post.

https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1421431

and was told to submit the photo ID here: https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1421431
 
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airkas1
Head Screener
Posts: 7385
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sun May 05, 2019 9:40 am

Arnold, please upload the photo again, as priority, with a message to the screeners that it is a lost photo.
 
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cpd
Posts: 5874
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 12:58 pm

I just want to cite a specific example. Earlier today someone made reference to “special education” towards another user.

That is spectacularly offensive. The post was already reported, but I’d like to suggest anyone who goes to that level should be booted out immediately.

Extremely disappointing. If people cannot be civil, then they shouldn’t be here.
 
DALMD80
Posts: 176
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:25 pm

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 1:59 pm

tcfc424 wrote:
I joined this site sixteen years ago and was mesmerized by the information that was available here.

I wound up finding a job as a ramper for UA through this site and loved my time there.

I have engaged with many people from different facets of aviation through this site.

I have learned tremendous amounts of information regarding crashes, airline direction, operations and such from this site.

I have seen some of the most amazing aviation photography on this site.

I have always loved that I can leverage my aviation geekiness by showing people that mainstream media quotes Anet.

HOWEVER.

Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)

I agree on some points. However, I am 13 and I REALLY want to become a pilot. I feel that I have a right to use this site. Nobody else really gets me and my av-geekiness. People make fun of me for it sometimes. They just can't leave me alone. The only people that get me are A) My father, and that's only part of the time, B) Pilots, C) Planespotters,
and D) A.netters. This site is really THE way I can express total avgeekness.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
zakuivcustom
Posts: 2377
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 2:36 pm

tcfc424 wrote:
Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)


Except, again, just dig up old threads and you'll see things like "Why (insert airlines here) doesn't fly (insert planes here)" thread from 10+ years ago.

Seriously, what's wrong with younger generation asking questions? Curiosity is how you pass on interest to the next generation. Granted, there are probably not as much "expert answer" nowaday vs. answers from average posters that may not know as much, but that doesn't mean there should be some "age elitism" that seems to be prominent.

Yes...I'm personally tired of some of the threads myself. But it's not that hard to ignore them.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 2:45 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
tcfc424 wrote:
Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)


Except, again, just dig up old threads and you'll see things like "Why (insert airlines here) doesn't fly (insert planes here)" thread from 10+ years ago.

Seriously, what's wrong with younger generation asking questions? Curiosity is how you pass on interest to the next generation. Granted, there are probably not as much "expert answer" nowaday vs. answers from average posters that may not know as much, but that doesn't mean there should be some "age elitism" that seems to be prominent.

Yes...I'm personally tired of some of the threads myself. But it's not that hard to ignore them.

Agreed. Now, being one of the "snarky [13] year olds" (what's one year, after all?) I feel like with all of the effort to get people of my generation interested in aviation, you want to get us out. As I said before, I am made fun of for wanting to be a pilot, playing flight simulators, using airline management sims, etc. I think that anyone should be allowed to use the site. I agree that some threads are boring/tiresome. I also agree that there is "age elitism" going on here. We should be allowed to ask questions and express ourselves, as in my case, this is one of the few places I can do that without being made fun of.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
tcfc424
Topic Author
Posts: 531
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 11:56 am

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 6:22 pm

Let me first apologize, to you DALMD80, you are one of the exceptions to the rule. I think its great that younger people are getting involved in aviation and such. I certainly understand the geekiness part, its the same for me...my friends don't get it. I certainly did not mean that as a blanket rule young people had nothing to offer. However, we have all seen serious threads, informational threads get hijacked by argumentative and immature posters (and some of those may be in their 50's) which leads the people that could provide information to ignore the thread and move on instead of sharing their knowledge. It's just frustrating that a lot of the people who were "in the know" and were passionate about aviation have abandoned this site due to the immaturity of some posters and the fanboy junk that pervades almost every thread.
 
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Moose135
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 7:01 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
Seriously, what's wrong with younger generation asking questions? Curiosity is how you pass on interest to the next generation. Granted, there are probably not as much "expert answer" nowaday vs. answers from average posters that may not know as much, but that doesn't mean there should be some "age elitism" that seems to be prominent.

A while back, I was sitting on a bench doing a little shooting at the CLT airport overlook. A youngster, maybe 10 years old, asked if he could sit with me, because no one else wanted him around. He proceeded to ask me about 824 questions about airplanes and airports, and even exclaimed "Is that plane on fire???" when a smoky old DL DC-9 was on approach. I'm sure it made his day to have an adult sit and talk to him about airplanes for a little bit.

And to think it's the kids who are the big problem, take a look at the thread on the Miami Air overrun incident. For every post about the incident itself, there were half a dozen arguing about the overrun rate of 737s compared to A320s, which model had more in service, and half a dozen other nonsensical issues unrelated to the actual incident, and many were from members with 10 or more years on the forums.
KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 7:10 pm

Moose135 wrote:
And to think it's the kids who are the big problem, take a look at the thread on the Miami Air overrun incident. For every post about the incident itself, there were half a dozen arguing about the overrun rate of 737s compared to A320s, which model had more in service, and half a dozen other nonsensical issues unrelated to the actual incident, and many were from members with 10 or more years on the forums.


Indeed. To blame everything on some "(physically) 13 years old" is just too much of a blanket statement IMHO. Now, I can't say the same about "(mentally) 13 years old", which there are certainly some, and physically they may be much, much older.

There are certain things that I agree with the OP - and in general, the "decline" does steam from the fact that there are definitely a LOT less SMEs. It's fine being arm-chair expert (I act like one at times), but very often those arm-chair expert just doesn't listen when they have been pointed out that they're wrong.

Ultimately, nothing to do with (physical) age.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 9:39 pm

tcfc424 wrote:
Let me first apologize, to you DALMD80, you are one of the exceptions to the rule. I think its great that younger people are getting involved in aviation and such. I certainly understand the geekiness part, its the same for me...my friends don't get it. I certainly did not mean that as a blanket rule young people had nothing to offer. However, we have all seen serious threads, informational threads get hijacked by argumentative and immature posters (and some of those may be in their 50's) which leads the people that could provide information to ignore the thread and move on instead of sharing their knowledge. It's just frustrating that a lot of the people who were "in the know" and were passionate about aviation have abandoned this site due to the immaturity of some posters and the fanboy junk that pervades almost every thread.

No problem sir. I apologize to you as well, I may have been a bit to aggressive pushing my point. Anyway... it's all good. It's quite true that people are... immature and act like they know things they don't. I do wish more people were, as you put it, "in the know". Hope to see you around.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 06, 2019 9:44 pm

Moose135 wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
Seriously, what's wrong with younger generation asking questions? Curiosity is how you pass on interest to the next generation. Granted, there are probably not as much "expert answer" nowaday vs. answers from average posters that may not know as much, but that doesn't mean there should be some "age elitism" that seems to be prominent.

A while back, I was sitting on a bench doing a little shooting at the CLT airport overlook. A youngster, maybe 10 years old, asked if he could sit with me, because no one else wanted him around. He proceeded to ask me about 824 questions about airplanes and airports, and even exclaimed "Is that plane on fire???" when a smoky old DL DC-9 was on approach. I'm sure it made his day to have an adult sit and talk to him about airplanes for a little bit.

And to think it's the kids who are the big problem, take a look at the thread on the Miami Air overrun incident. For every post about the incident itself, there were half a dozen arguing about the overrun rate of 737s compared to A320s, which model had more in service, and half a dozen other nonsensical issues unrelated to the actual incident, and many were from members with 10 or more years on the forums.

Nice to hear. Once at BWI I saw a G2 or something that was trailing a TON of smoke. That was crazy. If you're ever in the area, PM me and I'll let you know if/when I'll be at BWI.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
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compensateme
Posts: 3144
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Tue May 07, 2019 11:25 pm

The fourm's declining because it's much more liberally moderated today than years' past. For example, UA857 (who lists his age as 16) has started 100+ generic, vague, low-quality threads. In the Johan days, he would've been banned before he hit a dirty dozen (let alone triple digits). But here's the problem: his threads are (usually) really, really popular, often by veteran users who want to argue about what CO's service was like pre-merger, the demise of EA, or whether DL would've ordered Airbus had it not acquired NW. He's basically a content farm for a.net, attracting page views which generates $$$ for the website. So whereas A.net use to be like The NY Times or WSJ... now it's BuzzFeed.
Nobody cares what your next flight is...
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 12:22 am

tcfc424 wrote:
I joined this site sixteen years ago and was mesmerized by the information that was available here.

I wound up finding a job as a ramper for UA through this site and loved my time there.

I have engaged with many people from different facets of aviation through this site.

I have learned tremendous amounts of information regarding crashes, airline direction, operations and such from this site.

I have seen some of the most amazing aviation photography on this site.

I have always loved that I can leverage my aviation geekiness by showing people that mainstream media quotes Anet.

HOWEVER.

Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)

I agree that some changes should be made, because our (moderator) policies are essentially the same as when users had paid memberships, but to assert that these sorts of issues didn't previously exist is simply not true. Even a decade ago or more, there were plenty of low quality posts, personal attacks, clickbait, etc. What's changed is that the internet itself is a much different place than it used to be, and perhaps even the types of people drawn to internet forums (the concept of which has been generally declining for years). This forum is no different, and the content and quality itself hasn't changed significantly over the years — just go back and read some old threads, because I've spent plenty of time doing that myself, and things didn't used to be all that different.

Ultimately, I think that people just like to reminisce over what they perceive to be "better days" (not that it's a bad thing). We have lost a number of great contributors over the years, but that doesn't mean we don't still have plenty of great ones now. We just tend to only think of the people who have left. Some users still love to talk about how much they miss the old site, but I guess they forget the fairly regular outages that would last for days, or the broken features, or the weird quirks. It was a website held together with masking tape (unfortunately this new site isn't much better, but at least it's more stable). The old website was truly homemade, and it was awesome, but while most of the users are different, the content itself and the problems we deal with aren't remarkably different.

I do want to make a point of saying this site hasn't been slowly ruined by 13 year olds. In fact, it's exceedingly rare that we have trouble of any kind with younger users — maybe their contributions are on a more basic level, but they're almost always respectful and eager to learn. It's the adults who throw ridiculous temper tantrums and think they know better than everyone else. I personally think that mindset does a disservice to the next generation, because we were all them at one time. Maybe we didn't have an internet forum, but we still had a passion for aviation. Some people on this site seem to act like we're in some exclusive club because we think we know things, when we should be encouraging young folks to be engaged. There are enough salty old jerks who work in this industry...we don't need to let that attitude permeate here. Especially when it's misdirected, since it's usually adults who cause the most problems. In 3+ years as a moderator, I have yet to have a teenager threaten to sue me because I banned his account, or have one unleash a torrent of personal attacks on me because I removed a thread.

compensateme wrote:
The fourm's declining because it's much more liberally moderated today than years' past. For example, UA857 (who lists his age as 16) has started 100+ generic, vague, low-quality threads. In the Johan days, he would've been banned before he hit a dirty dozen (let alone triple digits). But here's the problem: his threads are (usually) really, really popular, often by veteran users who want to argue about what CO's service was like pre-merger, the demise of EA, or whether DL would've ordered Airbus had it not acquired NW. He's basically a content farm for a.net, attracting page views which generates $$$ for the website. So whereas A.net use to be like The NY Times or WSJ... now it's BuzzFeed.

If you're implying that we're somehow directed to let people get away with things to boost ad revenue, that's completely ridiculous. Nobody from Vertical Scope tells us how to moderate these forums in any way, shape, or form. I've been a moderator for 3+ years, and no one from VS (or previously DM) has ever told me what to do. We make the forum rules, and we enforce them in the way that we feel appropriate. We are users first, after all. We only answer to the community, but we obviously have to do so in a way that we feel will best promote the well-being of the community. We don't purposely let garbage posts slide, but sometimes there's only so much we can do about them. Perhaps in contrast to years ago, we don't feel that it's generally our place to regulate what content is discussed, so long as it's appropriate and users can appropriately discuss the topic.

DALMD80 wrote:
Nice to hear. Once at BWI I saw a G2 or something that was trailing a TON of smoke. That was crazy. If you're ever in the area, PM me and I'll let you know if/when I'll be at BWI.

Definitely don't let some of these grouchy old guys get you down. Most of the people you'll meet in this industry are great people, so don't let bad attitudes get in your way. If you're in the DC area and you want to come check out a big ATC facility, just send me a message and I'd be happy to give you a tour.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 12:47 pm

atcsundevil wrote:
DALMD80 wrote:
Nice to hear. Once at BWI I saw a G2 or something that was trailing a TON of smoke. That was crazy. If you're ever in the area, PM me and I'll let you know if/when I'll be at BWI.

Definitely don't let some of these grouchy old guys get you down. Most of the people you'll meet in this industry are great people, so don't let bad attitudes get in your way. If you're in the DC area and you want to come check out a big ATC facility, just send me a message and I'd be happy to give you a tour.

WHAT!?!?! That sounds awesome. Might be in the area later this month. Are you at DCA or IAD?
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
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TVNWZ
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 12:48 pm

Pep would clean this up in an instant...:):))
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 12:51 pm

Or the Potomac Consolidated TRACON, for that matter.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 12:51 pm

TVNWZ wrote:
Pep would clean this up in an instant...:):))

Who's that? And why?
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
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TVNWZ
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 1:07 pm

Pep was ANCflyer. An ANet legend who was acerbic, caustic and took no crap from anyone. He was a moderator at one time who ruled with too iron a fist. He was banned for long times and I think eventually banned for life--or at least quit in a huff. One of a kind.
 
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Gonzalo
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 1:11 pm

As an Anetter with 14 years in the site, I think that we should look for some balance here in the diagnosis. Yes, the overall quality of the forum has decreased. Some really good features from the past are gone. For example : Ten years ago, when someone put an airline code or an airport code, the airline name or airport city name became visible when you put the mouse pointer above the code. Today, every time someone use a code, there is an avalanche of posts asking about the meaning of the code.
Other great loss for the site is the absence of very respected members who decided to go out after a lot of times being disrespected or mistreated by other members, civility of some members is at a low level and many times I have the feeling that moderators are too soft with this aggressive people. Years ago we had here real experts like Mandala499, experienced pilots like Pihero, and many others like them, who are now gone from the site after years of contributions.
But like I said at the first sentence we have to look for some balance in the diagnosis. This site STILL REMAINS like one of the best, or THE best place on the web regarding aviation. I think A.net should rank in the top 3 sites by any measurement you want to apply. It will be great if the site managers could take the time to analyze the causes of this changes and design a formula to allow this once magnificient site to thrive like it deserves.
Rgds.
Gonzalo
Gear Up!!: DC-3 / EMB-110 / FH-227 / A318-19-20-21 / B732 / B763 / B789 / B788 / A343 / ATR72-600
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 2:52 pm

Gonzalo wrote:
Other great loss for the site is the absence of very respected members who decided to go out after a lot of times being disrespected or mistreated by other members, civility of some members is at a low level and many times I have the feeling that moderators are too soft with this aggressive people. Years ago we had here real experts like Mandala499, experienced pilots like Pihero, and many others like them, who are now gone from the site after years of contributions.


Mandala499 is still around. But yes, when Mandala posts some of his insights into the ET crash, some of the replies to him are...well...unsavory, and they wonder why members like him rarely post anymore.

atcsundevil wrote:
In 3+ years as a moderator, I have yet to have a teenager threaten to sue me because I banned his account, or have one unleash a torrent of personal attacks on me because I removed a thread.


Somewhat off topic, but I didn't realized that people takes things THIS seriously. Seriously, suing somebody for banning an account? :white: :white:
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 4:04 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
Somewhat off topic, but I didn't realized that people takes things THIS seriously. Seriously, suing somebody for banning an account? :white: :white:

You would be amazed at some of the things people say. It's easy when you can hide behind a keyboard.
 
DALMD80
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 4:38 pm

Yikes. Suing? That's... excessive.
You can take the boy away from aviation, but you can't take aviation out of the boy.
 
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qf789
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 5:27 pm

atcsundevil wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
Somewhat off topic, but I didn't realized that people takes things THIS seriously. Seriously, suing somebody for banning an account? :white: :white:

You would be amazed at some of the things people say. It's easy when you can hide behind a keyboard.


Second that, though it doesn't happen often when it does all you want to do is bang your head against the wall, its rather pathetic when we do get threatened to be sued, whether its over a ban or us requesting for a user to change a signature line or avatar
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qf789
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 6:12 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
Gonzalo wrote:
Other great loss for the site is the absence of very respected members who decided to go out after a lot of times being disrespected or mistreated by other members, civility of some members is at a low level and many times I have the feeling that moderators are too soft with this aggressive people. Years ago we had here real experts like Mandala499, experienced pilots like Pihero, and many others like them, who are now gone from the site after years of contributions.


Mandala499 is still around. But yes, when Mandala posts some of his insights into the ET crash, some of the replies to him are...well...unsavory, and they wonder why members like him rarely post anymore.


It is fair to say that the site is very different to when those users who have left the site or do not post as much to what it is today. Firstly membership is free versus previously being charged for. Secondly the internet has evolved and is very different now to what it used to be. Some treat a.net as another social media outlet where as we would like to be considered as a community. In this day of facebook, twitter etc some think they can post what they like, when they like without consequence. At times it has been hard to contain, it has been particularly bad over the past 2 months since the 737MAX crash and subsequent events with the personal attacks and flamebait we have seen. We are addressing this by bringing in 4 new moderators, we also encourage all users that if they see a post not within the rules to report the post so we can put the ashes out before it becomes a bonfire. I do not think it is fair to label us as soft, I take a great deal of pride in moderating as do the other moderators however we can not just ban people, we have to allow for due process before taking such actions. Just to put things in perspective in January and February we handed out around 30 warnings each month. In March that went up to other 70 for the month, last month was around 50 and so far this month in the past 8 days we have already issued 30 warnings.

Saying all this I would also like to say that usually as mods we only deal with negative things however it does put a smile on our faces when we see a genuine goodwill gesture (ok atcsundevil I give you kudos here) for making an offer, in this case to DALMD80 and to see his response. Anyway DALMD80, when you go for your ATC tour ask atcsundevil as many questions as possible, he knows his stuff. Of course if you ever visit Australia and want to know some aviation stuff let me know
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zakuivcustom
Posts: 2377
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 6:21 pm

qf789 wrote:
It is fair to say that the site is very different to when those users who have left the site or do not post as much to what it is today. Firstly membership is free versus previously being charged for. Secondly the internet has evolved and is very different now to what it used to be. Some treat a.net as another social media outlet where as we would like to be considered as a community. In this day of facebook, twitter etc some think they can post what they like, when they like without consequence. At times it has been hard to contain, it has been particularly bad over the past 2 months since the 737MAX crash and subsequent events with the personal attacks and flamebait we have seen. We are addressing this by bringing in 4 new moderators, we also encourage all users that if they see a post not within the rules to report the post so we can put the ashes out before it becomes a bonfire. I do not think it is fair to label us as soft, I take a great deal of pride in moderating as do the other moderators however we can not just ban people, we have to allow for due process before taking such actions. Just to put things in perspective in January and February we handed out around 30 warnings each month. In March that went up to other 70 for the month, last month was around 50 and so far this month in the past 8 days we have already issued 30 warnings.


Again getting off topic, but personally I see no problem with the mods in general - I mean, it's not like you guys (or gals) get paid 5 cents per deleted post, China-style :duck: :duck: .

But yeah, those 737MAX threads are bad (I don't even bother reading them).
 
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Gonzalo
Posts: 1821
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:43 am

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 08, 2019 11:41 pm

qf789 wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
Gonzalo wrote:
Other great loss for the site is the absence of very respected members who decided to go out after a lot of times being disrespected or mistreated by other members, civility of some members is at a low level and many times I have the feeling that moderators are too soft with this aggressive people. Years ago we had here real experts like Mandala499, experienced pilots like Pihero, and many others like them, who are now gone from the site after years of contributions.


Mandala499 is still around. But yes, when Mandala posts some of his insights into the ET crash, some of the replies to him are...well...unsavory, and they wonder why members like him rarely post anymore.


It is fair to say that the site is very different to when those users who have left the site or do not post as much to what it is today. Firstly membership is free versus previously being charged for. Secondly the internet has evolved and is very different now to what it used to be. Some treat a.net as another social media outlet where as we would like to be considered as a community. In this day of facebook, twitter etc some think they can post what they like, when they like without consequence. At times it has been hard to contain, it has been particularly bad over the past 2 months since the 737MAX crash and subsequent events with the personal attacks and flamebait we have seen. We are addressing this by bringing in 4 new moderators, we also encourage all users that if they see a post not within the rules to report the post so we can put the ashes out before it becomes a bonfire. I do not think it is fair to label us as soft, I take a great deal of pride in moderating as do the other moderators however we can not just ban people, we have to allow for due process before taking such actions. Just to put things in perspective in January and February we handed out around 30 warnings each month. In March that went up to other 70 for the month, last month was around 50 and so far this month in the past 8 days we have already issued 30 warnings.

Saying all this I would also like to say that usually as mods we only deal with negative things however it does put a smile on our faces when we see a genuine goodwill gesture (ok atcsundevil I give you kudos here) for making an offer, in this case to DALMD80 and to see his response. Anyway DALMD80, when you go for your ATC tour ask atcsundevil as many questions as possible, he knows his stuff. Of course if you ever visit Australia and want to know some aviation stuff let me know


qf789, I apologize if my appreciation of mods being soft some times is unfair, I admit that obviously I'm not aware of every warning or punishment delivered for the mods team, and my opinion was based exclusively in the few times when I was involved in discussions where others have been rude or disrespectful, usually all we see in those cases is a post deletion and nothing more, so probably I have a wrong - and unfair - perception.
In any case, I want to take the opportunity to ask why some of the old, good features of the site were removed for ever. If it was a technical or financial decision, it will be understandable, but as far as I know the reason for this changes was never explained to the site members/users.
From the top of my head I remember the following things that has been downgraded or removed from the old site, with a worst overall experience :
1. Profile information was reduced basically to just the user's name. I understand the privacy and sensitive information of every person is very important, but in the past, someone looking to a user's profile was able to see city/country of location, professional background, age, and other information very useful at the time to engage in a civilized discussion about a topic. All that information was not mandatory, every user was able to add the info or not in the personal profile, and in my experience, for the big majority of members, it was useful to add perspective and personal background to the different participants of the conversations. Now, we don't know almost anything about the other members, and the feeling of community has decreased deeply IMHO.
2. The Respected Members feature... why was it removed is a mystery for me. It was completely harmless, and was very useful to know the level of knowledge and civility of the other members.
3. I mentioned in my earlier post but again, the old feature where you can get the complete information just putting the mouse pointer on the airline or airport code was really useful and friendly and never understood why was also eliminated. For the members who arrived after the removal of that feature and never had the chance to see it, was something like this : pointing the mouse above - LA -, you had a small pop up displaying Latam Airlines, it worked very well with all the airline's codes from IATA.
The feature worked similarly with airports, pointing the mouse above - SCL -, you had a small pop up displaying Santiago-Arturo Merino Benitez Intl.
Maybe some of this good old features can be reinstated for the sake of a better user experience.

Rgds.
Gonzalo
Gear Up!!: DC-3 / EMB-110 / FH-227 / A318-19-20-21 / B732 / B763 / B789 / B788 / A343 / ATR72-600
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Thu May 09, 2019 12:02 am

Gonzalo wrote:
qf789, I apologize if my appreciation of mods being soft some times is unfair, I admit that obviously I'm not aware of every warning or punishment delivered for the mods team, and my opinion was based exclusively in the few times when I was involved in discussions where others have been rude or disrespectful, usually all we see in those cases is a post deletion and nothing more, so probably I have a wrong - and unfair - perception.
In any case, I want to take the opportunity to ask why some of the old, good features of the site were removed for ever. If it was a technical or financial decision, it will be understandable, but as far as I know the reason for this changes was never explained to the site members/users.
From the top of my head I remember the following things that has been downgraded or removed from the old site, with a worst overall experience :
1. Profile information was reduced basically to just the user's name. I understand the privacy and sensitive information of every person is very important, but in the past, someone looking to a user's profile was able to see city/country of location, professional background, age, and other information very useful at the time to engage in a civilized discussion about a topic. All that information was not mandatory, every user was able to add the info or not in the personal profile, and in my experience, for the big majority of members, it was useful to add perspective and personal background to the different participants of the conversations. Now, we don't know almost anything about the other members, and the feeling of community has decreased deeply IMHO.
2. The Respected Members feature... why was it removed is a mystery for me. It was completely harmless, and was very useful to know the level of knowledge and civility of the other members.
3. I mentioned in my earlier post but again, the old feature where you can get the complete information just putting the mouse pointer on the airline or airport code was really useful and friendly and never understood why was also eliminated. For the members who arrived after the removal of that feature and never had the chance to see it, was something like this : pointing the mouse above - LA -, you had a small pop up displaying Latam Airlines, it worked very well with all the airline's codes from IATA.
The feature worked similarly with airports, pointing the mouse above - SCL -, you had a small pop up displaying Santiago-Arturo Merino Benitez Intl.
Maybe some of this good old features can be reinstated for the sake of a better user experience.

Rgds.
Gonzalo

No features were ever removed. You're referring to the old website platform, which no longer exists. This website platform is 100% different from the old website. When the migration occurred almost three years ago, the old website switched off for good. Perhaps to answer your question more appropriately: why were those features not replicated on the new website? It's complicated, but here are a few reasons.

One, the old site was 100% custom, whereas this site is a highly modified "off the shelf" platform called phpBB. Some features created on the old site were unique and not replicated to any other forum I've ever seen.

Two, this website platform was created quite quickly. I believe the original intention was to adapt many of the customizations from the old site, but it ended up being an undertaking too large for the developer to handle. As it is, this current site is highly customized, and because of that, it has created a number of instabilities that make it difficult for the current developer team to handle. It seems that PhpBB was simply never designed to do what this website does.

Three, while many of the old features were great, some of them functioned poorly or didn't have much practical purpose. Everyone loved the hover function on the airport codes, and it was indeed a great feature; however, it displayed the wrong information a huge portion of the time. It also triggered for any other acronym whether intended or not, and drove a lot of people crazy. So I think these days, a lot of people have built up these features to be better or more reliable than they actually were.

I'm sure there are more reasons, but these are the ones that come to mind. I think we all loved the old website, but more for reasons of nostalgia than anything else.
 
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Gonzalo
Posts: 1821
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Thu May 09, 2019 1:05 am

atcsundevil wrote:
Gonzalo wrote:
qf789, I apologize if my appreciation of mods being soft some times is unfair, I admit that obviously I'm not aware of every warning or punishment delivered for the mods team, and my opinion was based exclusively in the few times when I was involved in discussions where others have been rude or disrespectful, usually all we see in those cases is a post deletion and nothing more, so probably I have a wrong - and unfair - perception.
In any case, I want to take the opportunity to ask why some of the old, good features of the site were removed for ever. If it was a technical or financial decision, it will be understandable, but as far as I know the reason for this changes was never explained to the site members/users.
From the top of my head I remember the following things that has been downgraded or removed from the old site, with a worst overall experience :
1. Profile information was reduced basically to just the user's name. I understand the privacy and sensitive information of every person is very important, but in the past, someone looking to a user's profile was able to see city/country of location, professional background, age, and other information very useful at the time to engage in a civilized discussion about a topic. All that information was not mandatory, every user was able to add the info or not in the personal profile, and in my experience, for the big majority of members, it was useful to add perspective and personal background to the different participants of the conversations. Now, we don't know almost anything about the other members, and the feeling of community has decreased deeply IMHO.
2. The Respected Members feature... why was it removed is a mystery for me. It was completely harmless, and was very useful to know the level of knowledge and civility of the other members.
3. I mentioned in my earlier post but again, the old feature where you can get the complete information just putting the mouse pointer on the airline or airport code was really useful and friendly and never understood why was also eliminated. For the members who arrived after the removal of that feature and never had the chance to see it, was something like this : pointing the mouse above - LA -, you had a small pop up displaying Latam Airlines, it worked very well with all the airline's codes from IATA.
The feature worked similarly with airports, pointing the mouse above - SCL -, you had a small pop up displaying Santiago-Arturo Merino Benitez Intl.
Maybe some of this good old features can be reinstated for the sake of a better user experience.

Rgds.
Gonzalo

No features were ever removed. You're referring to the old website platform, which no longer exists. This website platform is 100% different from the old website. When the migration occurred almost three years ago, the old website switched off for good. Perhaps to answer your question more appropriately: why were those features not replicated on the new website? It's complicated, but here are a few reasons.

One, the old site was 100% custom, whereas this site is a highly modified "off the shelf" platform called phpBB. Some features created on the old site were unique and not replicated to any other forum I've ever seen.

Two, this website platform was created quite quickly. I believe the original intention was to adapt many of the customizations from the old site, but it ended up being an undertaking too large for the developer to handle. As it is, this current site is highly customized, and because of that, it has created a number of instabilities that make it difficult for the current developer team to handle. It seems that PhpBB was simply never designed to do what this website does.

Three, while many of the old features were great, some of them functioned poorly or didn't have much practical purpose. Everyone loved the hover function on the airport codes, and it was indeed a great feature; however, it displayed the wrong information a huge portion of the time. It also triggered for any other acronym whether intended or not, and drove a lot of people crazy. So I think these days, a lot of people have built up these features to be better or more reliable than they actually were.

I'm sure there are more reasons, but these are the ones that come to mind. I think we all loved the old website, but more for reasons of nostalgia than anything else.


Fair enough....and you’re probably right about the nostalgia too :)

Thanks for your answers !
Rgds.
G.
Gear Up!!: DC-3 / EMB-110 / FH-227 / A318-19-20-21 / B732 / B763 / B789 / B788 / A343 / ATR72-600
 
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compensateme
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Fri May 10, 2019 5:42 pm

atcsundevil wrote:
If you're implying that we're somehow directed to let people get away with things to boost ad revenue, that's completely ridiculous. Nobody from Vertical Scope tells us how to moderate these forums in any way, shape, or form. I've been a moderator for 3+ years, and no one from VS (or previously DM) has ever told me what to do. We make the forum rules, and we enforce them in the way that we feel appropriate. We are users first, after all. We only answer to the community, but we obviously have to do so in a way that we feel will best promote the well-being of the community. We don't purposely let garbage posts slide, but sometimes there's only so much we can do about them. Perhaps in contrast to years ago, we don't feel that it's generally our place to regulate what content is discussed, so long as it's appropriate and users can appropriately discuss the topic.


That's inaccurate. During the Johan years, the site emphasized high standards to build a reputation known for quality (especially after Chris Kilroy launched JP). The initial moderator team, lead by Hepkat, so forcefully enforced these standards that there was a time period where you'd think before posting something, otherwise you'd be banned. DM definitely asked the site to back off -- Johan's lead a quality-based model, DM lead a volume-based model (the company remains the largest content farmer on the Internet). Many long-time users protested the change, received warnings/suspensions, and choose to leave.
Nobody cares what your next flight is...
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Fri May 10, 2019 5:58 pm

Should someone start a new site for us oldies, Airliners.net The Wonder Years :cloudnine:
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Fri May 10, 2019 9:20 pm

compensateme wrote:
atcsundevil wrote:
If you're implying that we're somehow directed to let people get away with things to boost ad revenue, that's completely ridiculous. Nobody from Vertical Scope tells us how to moderate these forums in any way, shape, or form. I've been a moderator for 3+ years, and no one from VS (or previously DM) has ever told me what to do. We make the forum rules, and we enforce them in the way that we feel appropriate. We are users first, after all. We only answer to the community, but we obviously have to do so in a way that we feel will best promote the well-being of the community. We don't purposely let garbage posts slide, but sometimes there's only so much we can do about them. Perhaps in contrast to years ago, we don't feel that it's generally our place to regulate what content is discussed, so long as it's appropriate and users can appropriately discuss the topic.


That's inaccurate. During the Johan years, the site emphasized high standards to build a reputation known for quality (especially after Chris Kilroy launched JP). The initial moderator team, lead by Hepkat, so forcefully enforced these standards that there was a time period where you'd think before posting something, otherwise you'd be banned. DM definitely asked the site to back off -- Johan's lead a quality-based model, DM lead a volume-based model (the company remains the largest content farmer on the Internet). Many long-time users protested the change, received warnings/suspensions, and choose to leave.

What part of what I said is inaccurate? Where I said that neither DM nor VS has ever told me how to moderate? Because what I said was 100% accurate. I was never attempting to speak about moderating before my time as a moderator, because I can't speak to that with any more authority than you can. I can speak authoritatively about my 3+ years as a moderator, in which time I have never once been contacted by anyone from DM or VS regarding moderation.
 
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cpd
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sat May 11, 2019 3:59 am

DALMD80 wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
tcfc424 wrote:
Since Johan sold the site, the only things that I see are the 12-year olds asking why Midwest Express didn't by the 747-100, why UA doesn't fly OMA-LOS, and why Via Air didn't order the A321neo. There are a lot of good discussions still remaining on this site, but they are quickly being overrun by A v B wars and US v everyone else. It's sad that I long for the posts of when DL will retire the DC-9. The 757 resurrection threads still exist, so there's that. I'm just ranting because I think this site has gone to hell. There's still some good information to be had, but you have to dig through all of the BS to get to it and then deal with some snarky 12-year old when you ask a legit question that doesn't fit their narrative. Maybe if we start using cursive script we can confuse the little ones? Maybe a Wonderlic test to sign up? So disappointing because I love this site (and still visit more often than I will tell my wife.)


Except, again, just dig up old threads and you'll see things like "Why (insert airlines here) doesn't fly (insert planes here)" thread from 10+ years ago.

Seriously, what's wrong with younger generation asking questions? Curiosity is how you pass on interest to the next generation. Granted, there are probably not as much "expert answer" nowaday vs. answers from average posters that may not know as much, but that doesn't mean there should be some "age elitism" that seems to be prominent.

Yes...I'm personally tired of some of the threads myself. But it's not that hard to ignore them.

Agreed. Now, being one of the "snarky [13] year olds" (what's one year, after all?) I feel like with all of the effort to get people of my generation interested in aviation, you want to get us out. As I said before, I am made fun of for wanting to be a pilot, playing flight simulators, using airline management sims, etc. I think that anyone should be allowed to use the site. I agree that some threads are boring/tiresome. I also agree that there is "age elitism" going on here. We should be allowed to ask questions and express ourselves, as in my case, this is one of the few places I can do that without being made fun of.


Playing Flight Simulators huh? I seem to remember quite a number of pilots who have/had Flight Sim. Some here, others elsewhere. I was involved in the FS developer world for a time as well, some of that crowd were airline pilots too.

Just thought I’d mention that. :old:
 
FlyDeltaJetsATL
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sun May 12, 2019 6:57 am

Anet is declining because it has gone too far left. Take Non Av for instance. Just browsing the thread titles will indicate just how anti-right / pro-left Anet has become. The majority of threads are anti-right / anti-Trump yet some pro-right / anti-left comments will be deleted in a matter of minutes. Some of the comments make this site appear more like a sub-forum of CNN, the Washington Post or New York Times. A thread was started recently just to make fun of Putin tripping over after an ice-hockey match; wow! Non Av has become quite a sad place but there is some great reading for those looking for a laugh.

Jesse
FLY DELTA JETS
 
dutchspotter1
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sun May 12, 2019 7:39 am

Non-Av should not even be a part of this website IMO. Just stay with your core business. There are plenty if other websites to discuss Non-Av issues.
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Sun May 12, 2019 12:44 pm

FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:
Anet is declining because it has gone too far left. Take Non Av for instance. Just browsing the thread titles will indicate just how anti-right / pro-left Anet has become. The majority of threads are anti-right / anti-Trump yet some pro-right / anti-left comments will be deleted in a matter of minutes. Some of the comments make this site appear more like a sub-forum of CNN, the Washington Post or New York Times. A thread was started recently just to make fun of Putin tripping over after an ice-hockey match; wow! Non Av has become quite a sad place but there is some great reading for those looking for a laugh.

Jesse

Perhaps I should remind you that this is an aviation website, and that the way political content is perceived in the Non Aviation Forum is less important to most users (and us, by extension) than the quality of discussion in the other forums. Most moderators are in favor of getting rid of political discussion entirely, myself included. If you feel that there's some sort of bias in the Non Aviation Forum, then I suggest you enjoy the site by reading the aviation forums instead.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 13, 2019 12:35 am

I'm one of the longtimers who has reduced his postings out of frustration with the snowflake generation who refuse to accept fact/data if it conflicts with their opinion. This year alone I've blocked 3 people because I can't stand their rantings or personal insults, whereas I had no foes before 2019.
I've also noticed some snowflakes- when their feelings are hurt- then have posts removed which is quite funny as the same person openly insults me on another site :-)
 
FlyDeltaJetsATL
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 13, 2019 7:40 am

dutchspotter1 wrote:
Non-Av should not even be a part of this website IMO. Just stay with your core business. There are plenty if other websites to discuss Non-Av issues.


Good idea. I agree.

atcsundevil wrote:
Most moderators are in favor of getting rid of political discussion entirely, myself included.


Another good idea that I agree with.

Jesse
FLY DELTA JETS
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 13, 2019 8:09 am

FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:

atcsundevil wrote:
Most moderators are in favor of getting rid of political discussion entirely, myself included.


Another good idea that I agree with.

Jesse


Honestly, this problem can be solved easily - don't participate. Don't read. Pretty soon if nobody reads, and nobody participates, they will die down.
I FLY KLM+ALASKA+QATAR+MALAYSIA+AIRASIA+MALINDO
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 13, 2019 10:41 am

atcsundevil wrote:
Perhaps I should remind you that this is an aviation website, and that the way political content is perceived in the Non Aviation Forum is less important to most users (and us, by extension) than the quality of discussion in the other forums. Most moderators are in favor of getting rid of political discussion entirely, myself included. If you feel that there's some sort of bias in the Non Aviation Forum, then I suggest you enjoy the site by reading the aviation forums instead.


Does aviation exist without politics? No. Both civil and military aviation are intertwined with politics and other economic factors.

This is just another rule to keep or delete posts at will.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Mon May 13, 2019 1:28 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
lDoes aviation exist without politics? No. Both civil and military aviation are intertwined with politics and other economic factors.

This is just another rule to keep or delete posts at will.

That isn't what I'm referring to. I'm talking about political topics that have absolutely nothing to do with aviation.
 
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cpd
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Tue May 14, 2019 7:18 am

FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:
Anet is declining because it has gone too far left. Take Non Av for instance. Just browsing the thread titles will indicate just how anti-right / pro-left Anet has become. The majority of threads are anti-right / anti-Trump yet some pro-right / anti-left comments will be deleted in a matter of minutes. Some of the comments make this site appear more like a sub-forum of CNN, the Washington Post or New York Times. A thread was started recently just to make fun of Putin tripping over after an ice-hockey match; wow! Non Av has become quite a sad place but there is some great reading for those looking for a laugh.

Jesse



So, you don’t want non-av or politics and then complaining about the site going too far to the left? That doesn’t make sense.

When I joined, there wasn’t all this silly left and right nonsense. That seems an awful long time ago. Now it’s just a playground for the keyboard warriors of the left and right trying to flame each other.

Maybe to post in non aviation you should have photos accepted in the database (or a record of having done so in the past). Maybe that’s too tough... Or paid membership to post there.

readytotaxi wrote:
Should someone start a new site for us oldies, Airliners.net The Wonder Years :cloudnine:


I’m not that old! :) There are a few veterans here it must be said. There was that parody site airwhiners...
 
Starfuryt
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 15, 2019 7:29 pm

I've been following a.net since freshman year of college (2004), and frankly I probably have enough fingers to count all the times I've gone to the non-av section of the forum in those 15 years. I for one wouldn't shed any tears if it got axed.
Since I'm no longer a broke student either i would fully support going back to paid subscription so 12 year old FSX and P3D warriors can't post their armchair opinions on every thread.

just my 2 cents

-Mikhail
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 15, 2019 8:49 pm

I have to laugh when I see posts like "This wouldn't happen if we still had paid membership" or "Paid membership would weed out the trolls". While I wasn't a paid member I was a lurker of these forums for years and and even in the paid membership days the money didn't stop trolls from coming on or low quality posts.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
FlyDeltaJetsATL
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Thu May 16, 2019 4:59 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:

atcsundevil wrote:
Most moderators are in favor of getting rid of political discussion entirely, myself included.


Another good idea that I agree with.

Jesse


Honestly, this problem can be solved easily - don't participate. Don't read.


What an original idea!

cpd wrote:
Maybe to post in non aviation you should have photos accepted in the database (or a record of having done so in the past). Maybe that’s too tough... Or paid membership to post there.


Agreed about the paid membership, but for all sub forums like it used to be.

I paid $25 USD when I joined.

Jesse
FLY DELTA JETS
 
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qf789
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Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Thu May 16, 2019 6:07 am

Starfuryt wrote:
I've been following a.net since freshman year of college (2004), and frankly I probably have enough fingers to count all the times I've gone to the non-av section of the forum in those 15 years. I for one wouldn't shed any tears if it got axed.
Since I'm no longer a broke student either i would fully support going back to paid subscription so 12 year old FSX and P3D warriors can't post their armchair opinions on every thread.

just my 2 cents

-Mikhail


Paid membership isn't coming back, well not in the near future anyway. We have asked numerous times and the response has been a NO everytime.

Secondly suggesting paid memberships to keep 12 year old's off the site is simply ridiculous. Some of these younger member's of the site contribute more on the site than let's say those users who proceed them in age. As long as they post within the rules and that applies to everyone there is no need to enforce restrictions.
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aaexecplat
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Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 2:49 pm

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 22, 2019 7:42 pm

Another long-time member here. This site is only a shadow of itself. While it is ostensibly made up of "airplane enthusiasts" or avgeeks, most of the discussion in the Civil Av forum is now A vs B or some other tribalism. It has become impossible reading the threads in there and it is aggravating that new threads pop up frequently so that some members can continue to dump on A or B or whatever. It has gotten so bad that I don't visit very often anymore and when I do, I rarely see the need to reply because there is no discussion. I certainly liked things better when subscriptions cost money, but if the new ownership prefers open floodgates, c'est la vie.
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 7159
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

Re: Why Anet Is Declining

Wed May 22, 2019 8:05 pm

FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:
A thread was started recently just to make fun of Putin tripping over after an ice-hockey match; wow! Non Av has become quite a sad place but there is some great reading for those looking for a laugh.

So how is this anti-Trump? It's very simple logic:

Is subject aviation related? If not, is the subject site related? If not, then Non-Aviation. Simple.

Don't tell me you clutched your pearls at the video of Putin tripping.

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Honestly, this problem can be solved easily - don't participate. Don't read. Pretty soon if nobody reads, and nobody participates, they will die down.
These folks like to play ball, but pack up when it doesn't go their way. They like calling everyone libtards and snowflakes, but cry foul when a post is deleted or they're in the minority. So they obviously prefer that no one post at all. While I do agree that many Non-Av posts go south very quick, it's the nature of the beast. No matter what the post is about, politics will rear its head (even in aviation related posts).
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."

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