twicearound
Posts: 132
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 8:10 pm

klm617 wrote:
FSDan wrote:
FlyHappy wrote:

I am 100% aware that seasonality to beach destinations is an across the board phenomena, for US3 and the smaller players. Though how much of the TATL fleet is sent to beach duty beyond the 757's? what do UA/AA do with their greater number of widebodies in the winter?


For UA, many international widebodies have been sent through Polaris modifications during the winter. AA redeploys additional capacity to their South America network when transatlantic is down. DL and AA both have increased domestic and short haul beach market widebody flights in the winter season - UA not quite as much in my observations. Then there are the winter seasonal routes such as AA's LAX-AKL and JFK-GIG, UA's upcoming EWR-CPT and SFO-DEL, etc. etc.

FlyHappy wrote:
a) it is Delta leadership that loves to promote "Global", they seem to define it on their own special terms, while seeming to shrink presence in rising/competitive markets.
b) kudos to DL for serving JNB and what, Dakar? Really, I mean it.
c) where did I ever opine that AA or UA are "Global" ? I merely pointed out that UA has Asia point of sale (and legacy of Pan Am ops), and AA has Latin Am point of sale (and strong legacy there). In contrast, DL has backed away from the NWA Asia legacy (right or wrong).
d) BA/EK/QR - yes, they probably are "Global", and they have no real domestic ops to speak of, so by default, geography, aggressive tactics, and state backing, yes - they are global. I'm not glamorizing it, just seems factual.


a) I guess I still haven't heard a good reason why they shouldn't call themselves "Global"... They fly 200+ international routes and serve 50+ countries on all 6 populated continents. Seems "global" to me, at least until I hear further definitions of how many cities on each continent must be served, or how many U.S. hubs need to be connected to said cities in order for it to count as legitimate service.
b) To reiterate what another poster provided, DL serves JNB, LOS, ACC, and DSS in Africa. At various points over the last 10-15 years, they've also tried out service to CPT, ABV, ROB, and CAI, and had planned others such as LAD, NBO, and SSG. The four destinations they still fly to are the ones that proved stable and profitable. I expect DL does have significant point of sale traffic from Africa, as they've served the market continuously for over 10 years, and have been one of few nonstop options to the U.S.
c) My apologies if I've projected opinions from other posters onto you. My general impression in this thread has been that a decent number of posters consider UA and AA to be global while DL isn't, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.



Let's be honest here the only true global airlines are the airlines from Europe. They serve every corner of the universe unlike many Asian , South American and North American carriers and if we did tag any of the US3 as a global airline it would be UA not AA or DL. Through their partnerships they become more diverse but in no way global in the sense like Pan Am was in it's hayday


Can you please provide any facts to substantiate your claims.
 
UAUA
Topic Author
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:50 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 8:15 pm

jeffrey0032j wrote:
FlyBitcoin wrote:
Detroit313 wrote:
Crazy that they don't fly to the world's largest business center along with New York and London.


Then that world's largest business center should support that flight and not cause it to lose $20 million a year.

They will be out of all TPAC that does not terminate in a hub for KE, MU, or VA. Except for Tokyo which will be all operate out of HND by late Spring 2020.

I think PEK, SIN, MNL are all on the chopping block.

Flying to non-hubs in Europe and Africa is profitable.
Doing so to Asia is not. Fares are just too low if you cannot fill those flights with ongoing connections.

SIN has higher yield than HKG had, partly because of lesser competition from the Chinese on US/JPN-SIN vs US-HKG/China.


Ummm…… But SIN has more low cost carriers.
My former profile name was United Airline.
 
klm617
Posts: 4339
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 8:57 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 10:48 pm

twicearound wrote:
klm617 wrote:
FSDan wrote:

For UA, many international widebodies have been sent through Polaris modifications during the winter. AA redeploys additional capacity to their South America network when transatlantic is down. DL and AA both have increased domestic and short haul beach market widebody flights in the winter season - UA not quite as much in my observations. Then there are the winter seasonal routes such as AA's LAX-AKL and JFK-GIG, UA's upcoming EWR-CPT and SFO-DEL, etc. etc.



a) I guess I still haven't heard a good reason why they shouldn't call themselves "Global"... They fly 200+ international routes and serve 50+ countries on all 6 populated continents. Seems "global" to me, at least until I hear further definitions of how many cities on each continent must be served, or how many U.S. hubs need to be connected to said cities in order for it to count as legitimate service.
b) To reiterate what another poster provided, DL serves JNB, LOS, ACC, and DSS in Africa. At various points over the last 10-15 years, they've also tried out service to CPT, ABV, ROB, and CAI, and had planned others such as LAD, NBO, and SSG. The four destinations they still fly to are the ones that proved stable and profitable. I expect DL does have significant point of sale traffic from Africa, as they've served the market continuously for over 10 years, and have been one of few nonstop options to the U.S.
c) My apologies if I've projected opinions from other posters onto you. My general impression in this thread has been that a decent number of posters consider UA and AA to be global while DL isn't, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.



Let's be honest here the only true global airlines are the airlines from Europe. They serve every corner of the universe unlike many Asian , South American and North American carriers and if we did tag any of the US3 as a global airline it would be UA not AA or DL. Through their partnerships they become more diverse but in no way global in the sense like Pan Am was in it's hayday


Can you please provide any facts to substantiate your claims.


Go to their respective timetables and just look at international destinations and countries served and the data will speak for it self.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 6767
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 10:56 pm

klm617 wrote:
FSDan wrote:
FlyHappy wrote:

I am 100% aware that seasonality to beach destinations is an across the board phenomena, for US3 and the smaller players. Though how much of the TATL fleet is sent to beach duty beyond the 757's? what do UA/AA do with their greater number of widebodies in the winter?


For UA, many international widebodies have been sent through Polaris modifications during the winter. AA redeploys additional capacity to their South America network when transatlantic is down. DL and AA both have increased domestic and short haul beach market widebody flights in the winter season - UA not quite as much in my observations. Then there are the winter seasonal routes such as AA's LAX-AKL and JFK-GIG, UA's upcoming EWR-CPT and SFO-DEL, etc. etc.

FlyHappy wrote:
a) it is Delta leadership that loves to promote "Global", they seem to define it on their own special terms, while seeming to shrink presence in rising/competitive markets.
b) kudos to DL for serving JNB and what, Dakar? Really, I mean it.
c) where did I ever opine that AA or UA are "Global" ? I merely pointed out that UA has Asia point of sale (and legacy of Pan Am ops), and AA has Latin Am point of sale (and strong legacy there). In contrast, DL has backed away from the NWA Asia legacy (right or wrong).
d) BA/EK/QR - yes, they probably are "Global", and they have no real domestic ops to speak of, so by default, geography, aggressive tactics, and state backing, yes - they are global. I'm not glamorizing it, just seems factual.


a) I guess I still haven't heard a good reason why they shouldn't call themselves "Global"... They fly 200+ international routes and serve 50+ countries on all 6 populated continents. Seems "global" to me, at least until I hear further definitions of how many cities on each continent must be served, or how many U.S. hubs need to be connected to said cities in order for it to count as legitimate service.
b) To reiterate what another poster provided, DL serves JNB, LOS, ACC, and DSS in Africa. At various points over the last 10-15 years, they've also tried out service to CPT, ABV, ROB, and CAI, and had planned others such as LAD, NBO, and SSG. The four destinations they still fly to are the ones that proved stable and profitable. I expect DL does have significant point of sale traffic from Africa, as they've served the market continuously for over 10 years, and have been one of few nonstop options to the U.S.
c) My apologies if I've projected opinions from other posters onto you. My general impression in this thread has been that a decent number of posters consider UA and AA to be global while DL isn't, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.



Let's be honest here the only true global airlines are the airlines from Europe. They serve every corner of the universe unlike many Asian , South American and North American carriers and if we did tag any of the US3 as a global airline it would be UA not AA or DL. Through their partnerships they become more diverse but in no way global in the sense like Pan Am was in it's hayday

So the only global European is BA because they are the only European airline to fly to all six continents, like DL, EK, QR, SA, QF and soon to be (again) UA.

I consider all the US3 to be global airlines. Pan Am was great and all but were only global in your eyes because they flew routes like LHR-DEL, or THR-ATH or whatever. They were constrained by technology. If they were here today they'd be flying 787s and A35ps from their US hubs too nonstop to places in the world instead of taking 8 planes to get to India or Singapore.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
Antarius
Posts: 1569
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 11:08 pm

AA is the most global. It's because they're hubbed in Miami, where from the 305

..... you can be Mr. Worldwide
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHTYYZ DEN DOH BLR MAA TXL MEX
 
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compensateme
Posts: 3279
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 4:17 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 11:25 pm

Antarius wrote:
AA is the most global. It's because they're hubbed in Miami, where from the 305

..... you can be Mr. Worldwide


Can you get to Miami or Shanghai nonstop from Miami? Or just those, as our President described them, ****hole countries?
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
Antarius
Posts: 1569
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 20, 2019 11:27 pm

compensateme wrote:
Antarius wrote:
AA is the most global. It's because they're hubbed in Miami, where from the 305

..... you can be Mr. Worldwide


Can you get to Miami or Shanghai nonstop from Miami? Or just those, as our President described them, ****hole countries?


You can assuredly get from Miami to Miami.

#Dale
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHTYYZ DEN DOH BLR MAA TXL MEX
 
UAUA
Topic Author
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:50 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Tue May 21, 2019 6:25 am

DL did HKG-LAX-HKG in the early to mid 90s. Why did that fail? It was an MD11.
My former profile name was United Airline.
 
winginit
Posts: 2546
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:23 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Tue May 21, 2019 1:48 pm

klm617 wrote:
Delta is very weak outside of South America and Europe.


Seems you're excluding anti-trust immunized joint venture partners with that statement, which is short-sighted. As of course you know, when you include JV carriers like AM and KE, Delta's JVs are exceptionally strong when it comes to network breadth across North America and Asia in addition to their TATL and South America strength.

klm617 wrote:
Let's be honest here the only true global airlines are the airlines from Europe.


Please provide specific examples as to what 'global' carriers you're referring to. Last I checked carriers like LH and AF don't even serve six continents whereas UA and DL do.
 
jeffrey0032j
Posts: 611
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:11 pm

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Tue May 21, 2019 2:37 pm

UAUA wrote:
jeffrey0032j wrote:
FlyBitcoin wrote:

Then that world's largest business center should support that flight and not cause it to lose $20 million a year.

They will be out of all TPAC that does not terminate in a hub for KE, MU, or VA. Except for Tokyo which will be all operate out of HND by late Spring 2020.

I think PEK, SIN, MNL are all on the chopping block.

Flying to non-hubs in Europe and Africa is profitable.
Doing so to Asia is not. Fares are just too low if you cannot fill those flights with ongoing connections.

SIN has higher yield than HKG had, partly because of lesser competition from the Chinese on US/JPN-SIN vs US-HKG/China.


Ummm…… But SIN has more low cost carriers.

Different market segments, and there is a lack of them on TYO-SIN non-stops.
 
UA857
Posts: 293
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:41 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Mon May 27, 2019 11:16 pm

Can Delta relaunch SEA-HKG once their A330neos arrive.
 
IPFreely
Posts: 2335
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 8:26 am

Re: Will DL return to Hong Kong anytime soon?

Tue May 28, 2019 2:32 am

klm617 wrote:
Delta is very weak outside of South America and Europe.


Correct, but what's wrong with that? Delta should do things where they can compete (like dominate the ATL-MCO Disneyworld shuttle market) and avoid things where they can't compete (like leaving the big ocean to the big boys).

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