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Mortyman
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Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:56 am

Trump have asked several times his advisors if he can't buy Greenland ...

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-eyes ... _lead_pos5

Trump is visiting Denmark soon.

Hopefully the Danes are smart and say no ..
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:02 am

If you think, things can't get any stranger........................

On so many leaves, NO.
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Airstud
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:10 am

Maybe on hearing that Greenland is under Denmark's purview he got excited and thought it was a gigantic Lego® set...
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seahawk
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:14 am

Clever idea, with the ice melting it could become a prime farmland for development.
 
Redd
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:14 am

Greenland does need a golf resort....

Image
 
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Loew
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:28 am

seahawk wrote:
Clever idea, with the ice melting it could become a prime farmland for development.


That´s a joke right?

On a side note, Greenland is of a high strategic diplomatic and military value, but I doubt that´s on Trump´s mind. Anyway Denmark is not going to sell and I would advise Trump to tread lightly so he doesn´t have to shut down the base at Thule as a result of his actions.
 
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:49 am

seahawk wrote:
Clever idea, with the ice melting it could become a prime farmland for development.


I admire your optimism, but Greenland is still within the Arctic Circle and unsuitable for farming even though some parts are no longer permanently covered in ice. What the receding ice has revealed, however, are substantial deposits of valuable gemstones waiting to be mined.
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AirPacific747
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:50 am

We already sold some islands in the Caribbean now part of the USVI to the US a long time ago when we needed the money and I think many Danes regret that a bit now. Maybe short term a good decision but long term kind of sad
 
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:53 am

Loew wrote:
seahawk wrote:
Clever idea, with the ice melting it could become a prime farmland for development.


That´s a joke right?

On a side note, Greenland is of a high strategic diplomatic and military value, but I doubt that´s on Trump´s mind. Anyway Denmark is not going to sell and I would advise Trump to tread lightly so he doesn´t have to shut down the base at Thule as a result of his actions.


I am not even sure Denmark could sell it even if they wanted to... isn´t there some autonomy thing going?

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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:59 am

AirPacific747 wrote:
We already sold some islands in the Caribbean now part of the USVI to the US a long time ago when we needed the money and I think many Danes regret that a bit now. Maybe short term a good decision but long term kind of sad


I am sure the Russians feel the same about Alaska.
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CPH-R
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:02 am

As bizarre as it might sound, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if some sections of Greenlandic society would be interested in this. There's been a bit of an independence drive going for a few years now, but they've also accepted that they have very little chance to retain their current levels of welfare after true independence (amusingly, some suggested that Denmark should continue paying for it, even after independence), so they've tried to buddy up to China by passing some very lax labour laws regarding rare earths extractions, essentially allowing Chinese mining companies to bring their own labour fource and working according to Chinese labour laws. This turned out to be a bit of a dud though as IIRC it never really got off the ground.

However, China's interest in Greenland as well as Russia's increased present in the Arctic region, has made the US realise they've been neglecting the region. Some newspapers have speculated that trump deciding to visit Denmark in September, has a lot to do with the work they're doing to catch up.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:39 am

Hmmm...

Does he know it's not actually green?
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AirPacific747
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 9:39 am

Dutchy wrote:
AirPacific747 wrote:
We already sold some islands in the Caribbean now part of the USVI to the US a long time ago when we needed the money and I think many Danes regret that a bit now. Maybe short term a good decision but long term kind of sad


I am sure the Russians feel the same about Alaska.


I’m sure they do.

The actual benefit I can see to selling to the US is to limit China’s and Russia’s influence in the Arctic. After all, US-EU relations are so much greater than one man in the office.

Also, Greenland has always been considered a large social office paid for by Denmark.

I guess if the price is right and we get our Caribbean islands back, then maybe :D
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 10:13 am

AirPacific747 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
AirPacific747 wrote:
We already sold some islands in the Caribbean now part of the USVI to the US a long time ago when we needed the money and I think many Danes regret that a bit now. Maybe short term a good decision but long term kind of sad


I am sure the Russians feel the same about Alaska.


I’m sure they do.

The actual benefit I can see to selling to the US is to limit China’s and Russia’s influence in the Arctic. After all, US-EU relations are so much greater than one man in the office.

Also, Greenland has always been considered a large social office paid for by Denmark.

I guess if the price is right and we get our Caribbean islands back, then maybe :D


Greenland is a much better investment with the global warming issue. We have a children's novel here in the Netherlands, were Greenland was a utopia: Kinderen van Moeder Aarde & Het helse paradijs & Het Gulden Vlies van Thule

Don't know if these are translated in English, but a brilliant novel if you are 9-12.
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ltbewr
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 10:43 am

Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.
 
Pyrex
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 11:13 am

BRB, trademarking the name "East Alaska".
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AirPacific747
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 11:57 am

 
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trpmb6
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:14 pm

CPH-R wrote:
As bizarre as it might sound, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if some sections of Greenlandic society would be interested in this. There's been a bit of an independence drive going for a few years now, but they've also accepted that they have very little chance to retain their current levels of welfare after true independence (amusingly, some suggested that Denmark should continue paying for it, even after independence), so they've tried to buddy up to China by passing some very lax labour laws regarding rare earths extractions, essentially allowing Chinese mining companies to bring their own labour fource and working according to Chinese labour laws. This turned out to be a bit of a dud though as IIRC it never really got off the ground.

However, China's interest in Greenland as well as Russia's increased present in the Arctic region, has made the US realise they've been neglecting the region. Some newspapers have speculated that trump deciding to visit Denmark in September, has a lot to do with the work they're doing to catch up.


Finally, an excellent post detailing the realities of the geo-political importance of Greenland and why the USA might actually be interested in it. Thanks for sharing because I hadn't even really considered these things.
 
slider
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:11 pm

The US has made overtures to acquire Greenland since 1867, actually.

And two other presidential administrations have made offers to Denmark for it, who is struggling to support it. There's also a strategic reason to make the move--to freeze China out. Their interest in the Arctic is very well known.

Greenland is getting revenue from natural resources, which is leading to a reduction in the subsidies Denmark provides (potential full independence to follow?)
 
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:13 pm

ltbewr wrote:
Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.



One might also call it visionary.

Perhaps if you stopped with the kneejerk ORANGE MAN BAD schtick and pay attention to the motives and the political backdrop of Greenland, you'd realize why this makes sense.
 
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:26 pm

slider wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.



One might also call it visionary.

Perhaps if you stopped with the kneejerk ORANGE MAN BAD schtick and pay attention to the motives and the political backdrop of Greenland, you'd realize why this makes sense.


The purchase of Alaska was called "Seward's folly" at the time, and widely ridiculed in polite society at the time. Turned out a pretty good idea...
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:46 pm

And the reactions are in from Denmark en Greenland. They aren't all 100% positive:

> "We are open for business, but we're NOT for sale," said Denmark's foreign minister Ane Lone Bagger

> "If he is truly contemplating this, then this is final proof, that he has gone mad," foreign affairs spokesman for the Danish People’s Party, Soren Espersen, told broadcaster DR.

> "The thought of Denmark selling 50,000 citizens to the United States is completely ridiculous,“ he said.

> “I am sure a majority in Greenland believes it is better to have a relation to Denmark than the United States, in the long term,“ Aaja Chemnitz Larsen, Danish MP

> The prospect of US ownership also outraged residents in Nuuk, Greenland's tiny capital on its southwest coast. One local simply responded, “Oh please God no”, while another tweeted, “We are not something you can just buy. Keep away from our country“, adding the hashtag “#Jerk”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 62096.html
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:47 pm

slider wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.



One might also call it visionary.

Perhaps if you stopped with the kneejerk ORANGE MAN BAD schtick and pay attention to the motives and the political backdrop of Greenland, you'd realize why this makes sense.

Yes...visionary. More like ironic. Aren't you among those who argue that places are treating immigrants better than they do their homeless/poor (heck, we have a thread open on this) and that instead of letting immigrants use our resources, we should take care of our own?

How does buying Greenland help achieve that goal? We can't afford to subsidize healthcare or education, we have to cut food stamps and other social programs...but somehow we have enough money for war, for tax cuts, and now to buy an island?
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Glom
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:48 pm

Dutchy wrote:


Greenland is a much better investment with the global warming issue. We have a children's novel here in the Netherlands, were Greenland was a utopia: Kinderen van Moeder Aarde & Het helse paradijs & Het Gulden Vlies van Thule

Don't know if these are translated in English, but a brilliant novel if you are 9-12.


Without looking up any words:
The children of Mother Earth
The something paradise
The golden meat of Thule

Did I get that right (apart from not knowing helse)?
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:50 pm

Trump realized that there is no golf course in Greenland, nor tourism big enough to sustain a Trump Hotel at Nuuk, right?

Ok, there's the mineral/rare earth material, plus Trump can probably build gulags in Greenland near those mine for forced labor. :duck: :duck: . Plus having "Alaska East" that's an unsinkable aircraft carrier helps control the arctic.

But either way, it's not exactly for sale, and it's not like US can print tons of money right now to fund that when we need to fund the wall also, since Mexico is not paying for it. :banghead:
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:56 pm

The only way this would make ANY sort of sense would be to increase a stake of claim to the Arctic so that nations can exploit its resources, and for defense purposes (containing any Russian vessel to the Arctic and only letting them leave through Russia's narrow passage in the Bering Strait, assuming ice melts enough during summer to allow passage along Russian waters).

Let's say Denmark sells Greenland. What will Greenland become? A territory? A state? Kinda strange that territories waiting in limbo will get leapfrogged by an island with a population about 10x smaller than Wyoming. What a way to be a president to all Americans. Oh well...if it means Greenland sends 3 Democrats to Congress (1 Rep, 2 Sens), by all means. :bigthumbsup:

zakuivcustom wrote:
and it's not like US can print tons of money right now to fund that when we need to fund the wall also, since Mexico is not paying for it.

We are going to buy Greenland, and we will have Denmark pay to buy it.
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:17 pm

Glom wrote:
Dutchy wrote:


Greenland is a much better investment with the global warming issue. We have a children's novel here in the Netherlands, were Greenland was a utopia: Kinderen van Moeder Aarde & Het helse paradijs & Het Gulden Vlies van Thule

Don't know if these are translated in English, but a brilliant novel if you are 9-12.


Without looking up any words:
The children of Mother Earth
The something paradise
The golden meat of Thule

Did I get that right (apart from not knowing helse)?

First one is right
The hellish paradise
The golden fleece of Thule
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:24 pm

slider wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.



One might also call it visionary.

Perhaps if you stopped with the kneejerk ORANGE MAN BAD schtick and pay attention to the motives and the political backdrop of Greenland, you'd realize why this makes sense.

The real TDS right there. Did white men eat all the lead paint in the 60s?
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:20 pm

What about France selling New France ? That was not a great deal.

In an era of rising nationalism, I can't imagine any real country ceding any amount of territory at any price, let alone a piece of territory that large.

If we were talking about Zimbabwe, with the money going to the dictator's coffers, that'd be another story.
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Dahlgardo
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:39 pm

Well, at least it is a business proposal.

Had it been Russia they would just have invaded and annexed.

I suspect this is just some remark taken out of context, and not a serious proposal, but it is enough to activate all the obsessed anti-Trump trolls.

Trump is visiting Denmark early september and I'm sure US interests in the arctic region will be on the agenda, so it's probably related to that.
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casinterest
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:47 pm

Do the dutch want to swap for New Amsterdam?
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kaitak
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:53 pm

I think it's just a huge misunderstanding. He was going through his rolladex, worried about lawyers he could afford or who mightn't stay quiet (after Cohen), so he went "Greenbaum, Greenberg, Greenhalgh, Greenland ... can we buy any of these guys".

A frustrated aide just mentioned that "Don't know about the others, but Greenland's a bit icy sir; it'll take a lot."

"Yes, but can we buy him?"

And that's how rumours get spread ...
 
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:10 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Had it been Russia they would just have invaded and annexed.

As Greenland is a territory of Denmark, and Denmark is a NATO member, if Russia invaded and annexed Greenland, Denmark would immediately invoke Article 5 and, unless Trump ignores the invocation, Russia would be expelled in a flash.

That's why Ukraine dropped its non-aligned status and is seeking to join NATO and the EU: it is the only thing that can guarantee its territorial sovereignty.
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:34 pm

casinterest wrote:
Do the dutch want to swap for New Amsterdam?



Well, we swapped Surinam for it, perhaps we could undo this?
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bhill
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:34 pm

Buy Mexico first......THEN Canada.....
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bennett123
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:05 pm

Hard to see anyone who is interested in independence thinking this is a good idea.

If there are mineral rights then I imagine that they will want the benefit to go to Greenland or Denmark.
 
JJJ
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:19 pm

slider wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
Trump has a huge psychological, almost a sexual like thrill in doing deals, even if are of terrible business or political sense.



One might also call it visionary.

Perhaps if you stopped with the kneejerk ORANGE MAN BAD schtick and pay attention to the motives and the political backdrop of Greenland, you'd realize why this makes sense.


Does it make sense to look like a fool in front of a fellow NATO member?

The Danes ain't selling, and if Trump or anyone on his entourage thought it has any possibility of getting even discussed they're living on a planet further away than previously thought.
 
Pyrex
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:45 pm

Perhaps instead of buying Greenland, the U.S. should just take over Nunavut instead. By the time the Canadians bothered to send over a Mountie on a moose to check on it and noticed something weird was going on it would have been a couple of years at least, by then the U.S. could just claim it by homesteading.
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MikeDrop
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:49 pm

Mortyman wrote:
Trump have asked several times his advisors if he can't buy Greenland ...

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-eyes ... _lead_pos5

Trump is visiting Denmark soon.

Hopefully the Danes are smart and say no ..


This is truly amazing. Trump plans on visiting Denmark soon and suddenly an anonymous rumor in the press where someone is saying that the President has asked about it is now a full blown international incident, with massive negative reactions from the anti-Trumpers in the US, Denmark, and Greenland.

Has anyone actually asked President Trump if he said this? Has anyone asked if this is policy? Not as far as I can tell.

Just more anti-Trump churn designed to damage the President.

Mike Drop
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:53 pm

Pyrex wrote:
Perhaps instead of buying Greenland, the U.S. should just take over Nunavut instead. By the time the Canadians bothered to send over a Mountie on a moose to check on it and noticed something weird was going on it would have been a couple of years at least, by then the U.S. could just claim it by homesteading.

Maybe Canada should take over the Dakotas and Montana. Nobody of importance lives there anyway, and we'd remove 5 GOP Senators. Seems like an excellent scenario :bigthumbsup:

MikeDrop wrote:
Has anyone actually asked President Trump if he said this?
You're assuming he'd tell the truth to begin with. And you and I both know he won't.
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:57 pm

Pyrex wrote:
Perhaps instead of buying Greenland, the U.S. should just take over Nunavut instead. By the time the Canadians bothered to send over a Mountie on a moose to check on it and noticed something weird was going on it would have been a couple of years at least, by then the U.S. could just claim it by homesteading.


He should ask his handler how to do this. I am sure he will meet him soon.....
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:59 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
Has anyone actually asked President Trump if he said this? Has anyone asked if this is policy? Not as far as I can tell.


We live in a world, Mike, where there is news that the US president wants to buy Greenland and almost everyone says, yeah sure, the current US president might have said that, why not?
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Kilopond
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:08 pm

Mortyman wrote:
[...]Hopefully the Danes are smart and say no ..


Well, they sold their West Indies (Dansk Vestindien) to the US back in 1917. Now these islands are labeled US Virgin Islands.
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:20 pm

Dutchy wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
Has anyone actually asked President Trump if he said this? Has anyone asked if this is policy? Not as far as I can tell.


We live in a world, Mike, where there is news that the US president wants to buy Greenland and almost everyone says, yeah sure, the current US president might have said that, why not?

Actually, this is incorrect. This is not “news”. It is an anonymous allegation or rumor. And it is incorrect to say that the rumor is that Trump wants to buy Greenland. The rumor is that he asked about it with various levels of seriousness.

Pretty thin stuff to be getting all worked up over, but it’s been this way since November of 2016.

Mike Drop
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:30 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
Actually, this is incorrect. This is not “news”. It is an anonymous allegation or rumor. And it is incorrect to say that the rumor is that Trump wants to buy Greenland. The rumor is that he asked about it with various levels of seriousness.

Pretty thin stuff to be getting all worked up over, but it’s been this way since November of 2016.

Mike Drop


It is in the news, sorry man, it has been in the news in The Netherlands. So the point is still valid. It is sad and funny at the same time. Not many people are getting worked up, more people just shake their heads.

I see you take the "everybody is against Trump" route, we see it a lot with the defenders of populist all over the world. An easy defense mechanism, but quite weak if you think about it.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:41 pm

Dutchy wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
Actually, this is incorrect. This is not “news”. It is an anonymous allegation or rumor. And it is incorrect to say that the rumor is that Trump wants to buy Greenland. The rumor is that he asked about it with various levels of seriousness.

Pretty thin stuff to be getting all worked up over, but it’s been this way since November of 2016.

Mike Drop


It is in the news, sorry man, it has been in the news in The Netherlands. So the point is still valid. It is sad and funny at the same time. Not many people are getting worked up, more people just shake their heads.

I see you take the "everybody is against Trump" route, we see it a lot with the defenders of populist all over the world. An easy defense mechanism, but quite weak if you think about it.


Defense against what? My observation of the situation is spot on accurate. My point is that there doesn’t seem to be anyone looking at this story with a skeptical and critical eye. Anyone who steps back from their partisan beliefs and looks at this will come to some different conclusions I think. And that is what we should be talking about. The first question is this - why is this suddenly a story today? Clearly someone has an agenda in making these claims at this time. Who is pushing this agenda and what is it.

The anti-Trumpers jump on these stories so fast that they often don’t ask any of these questions. Many times they turn out to be fake.

Anyway, I’m sure that I’m not convincing you of anything so we can just leavit it at that.

Cheers,

Mike Drop
Last edited by MikeDrop on Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
seb146
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:42 pm

Isn't Denmark at "war" with Canada over an uninhabited island off Greenland? The way I heard it, one side will plant their flag and a bottle of schnapps and a few weeks later, the other side will replace the flag and bottle of schnapps? I know Republicans will never go for this kind of battle.

It baffles me that he regularly puts out crazy and racist and nonsensical things on the OFFICIAL presidential social media accounts but MAGA fan boys dismiss it.
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MikeDrop
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:46 pm

seb146 wrote:
It baffles me that he regularly puts out crazy and racist and nonsensical things on the OFFICIAL presidential social media accounts but MAGA fan boys dismiss it.

This wasn’t put out on any official twitter page, Trump hasn’t actually said anything about it, besides the anonymous allegations, and I’m not sure how you see that any of this is racist.
Mike Drop
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:54 pm

seb146 wrote:
Isn't Denmark at "war" with Canada over an uninhabited island off Greenland? The way I heard it, one side will plant their flag and a bottle of schnapps and a few weeks later, the other side will replace the flag and bottle of schnapps? I know Republicans will never go for this kind of battle.

It baffles me that he regularly puts out crazy and racist and nonsensical things on the OFFICIAL presidential social media accounts but MAGA fan boys dismiss it.


Yeah, Hans Island, the Whiskey wars, the funniest war in world history. :lol:
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
seb146
Posts: 20266
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Trump wants to buy Greenland

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:57 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
seb146 wrote:
It baffles me that he regularly puts out crazy and racist and nonsensical things on the OFFICIAL presidential social media accounts but MAGA fan boys dismiss it.

This wasn’t put out on any official twitter page, Trump hasn’t actually said anything about it, besides the anonymous allegations, and I’m not sure how you see that any of this is racist.
Mike Drop


It is obviously a thing if people are talking about it.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-eyes ... 1565904223

He asked advisers and WH council if he could do it.

When did I say anything about race?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

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