PPVRA
Posts: 8270
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

Re: Unrest in Bolivia

Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:18 pm

“If between now and in a little while... I were to return (to Bolivia) or someone else goes back, we must organize as in Venezuela armed militias of the people,” -Evo Morales

Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-boli ... SKBN1ZC066
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Unrest in Bolivia

Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:34 pm

PPVRA wrote:
“If between now and in a little while... I were to return (to Bolivia) or someone else goes back, we must organize as in Venezuela armed militias of the people,” -Evo Morales

Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-boli ... SKBN1ZC066



It's too bad Morales ended up this way. Many years ago he was a source of hope for Bolivians. He *was* the corruptable type.
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Jouhou
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Re: Unrest in Bolivia

Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:41 pm

N757ST wrote:
BN747 wrote:
PPVRA wrote:



Mind you, they did plenty of wickedness in Latin America, too.

And after nearly two decades in power, rather than fighting corruption, they disappointedly took part in it—often at the expense of the democratic process, and even stacking supreme courts across the region with people unqualified for the position, but who were given the position in exchange for a lifetime of favorable rulings.

That’s a stealth coup, the real coup, not the false and demeaning narrative they have created because they’ve lost power in democratic processes. The left is extremely arrogant to think they can’t lose power democratically. They must find a scape goat, always. Probably even harder for them to believe they lost elections after the millions in illegal campaign “donations” they received even while selling (and sometimes passing) laws requiring only public funds to finance election campaigns.

Fact is, the Latin American left is corrupt. They need to reinvent themselves, clean up their act, and give the people a mea culpa—something they have failed to do. Again, they’ve been too arrogant and still believe they’re god’s gift to humanity.

Democracy is finally working and people are putting these parties on “time out”. But there’s still an enormous struggle against the corrupt supreme courts who are fighting back, trying to protect their politicians with the same old “culture of impunity” legal tool box.

But thanks to the internet and social media, political engagement is extremely high. People at watching and they’re pushing Congress. Hard.



Yes, leftist governments are as corrupt throughout Latin America, because of a corrupt foundation was laid from their colonial past til this day. There has been periods of leaders breaking from tradition (corruption, nepotism especially) but the never last.

But Latin dictatorial leaders have always gone the martial law route to impose fear among the population.

But true Democracy can only from leftist thought (free thoughts/thinking politically), it cannot ever come from a Rightwing gov't...that approach only reinforces 'the status quo' of 'no changes necessary and a guarantee of the repression of political activism (silencing them).

Violence from the left has usually come in the form of protests..from the right it comes in the form of quelling dissent.
Plus in many cases, America has played a horrific role in Latin America affairs prolonging the unnecessary misery of the masses.


BN747


Oh come on. Left versus right has many definitions, but traditionally the United States has been a right leaning government and democracy has flourished. Right- self reliance, limited government. Left- government reliance, collective socialism. Which either way you lean is up to you, but in very left leaning Soviet russia democracy sure didn’t flourish, and millions upon millions died as the USSR tried to implement its utopian industrial society. More on point, millions WILL die in leftist Venezuela, where government controls and corruption will eventually lead just like the USSR to mass starvation, unless the international community gets involved. Now, I’m not saying extreme right governments work either, the nazis are a perfect example of that. Extreme versions of left and right philosophy just don’t work. Communism, fascism, despotism... these are failed models. It’s the space in between we can go ahead and argue about.



In South America I'm not sure how concerned people are about left vs right as opposed to finding leaders that simply aren't corrupt. And sometimes, all of their options are extremely corrupt. They're in a perpetual bind.
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BN747
Posts: 7356
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Re: Unrest in Bolivia

Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:16 pm

Jouhou wrote:
N757ST wrote:
BN747 wrote:


Yes, leftist governments are as corrupt throughout Latin America, because of a corrupt foundation was laid from their colonial past til this day. There has been periods of leaders breaking from tradition (corruption, nepotism especially) but the never last.

But Latin dictatorial leaders have always gone the martial law route to impose fear among the population.

But true Democracy can only from leftist thought (free thoughts/thinking politically), it cannot ever come from a Rightwing gov't...that approach only reinforces 'the status quo' of 'no changes necessary and a guarantee of the repression of political activism (silencing them).

Violence from the left has usually come in the form of protests..from the right it comes in the form of quelling dissent.
Plus in many cases, America has played a horrific role in Latin America affairs prolonging the unnecessary misery of the masses.


BN747


Oh come on. Left versus right has many definitions, but traditionally the United States has been a right leaning government and democracy has flourished. Right- self reliance, limited government. Left- government reliance, collective socialism. Which either way you lean is up to you, but in very left leaning Soviet russia democracy sure didn’t flourish, and millions upon millions died as the USSR tried to implement its utopian industrial society. More on point, millions WILL die in leftist Venezuela, where government controls and corruption will eventually lead just like the USSR to mass starvation, unless the international community gets involved. Now, I’m not saying extreme right governments work either, the nazis are a perfect example of that. Extreme versions of left and right philosophy just don’t work. Communism, fascism, despotism... these are failed models. It’s the space in between we can go ahead and argue about.



In South America I'm not sure how concerned people are about left vs right as opposed to finding leaders that simply aren't corrupt. And sometimes, all of their options are extremely corrupt. They're in a perpetual bind.


That is true, but changes are happening, not in Bolivia like it is in Mexico.

In Mexico, Pres. Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador (AMLO) is running a much better social media campaign than any leader today, by daily releases of what the previous presidents were up to and revealing the billions in waste, Total BS spending, their past Cartel associations...in other words, as corrupt as Mexico's past has been ..this is Mexico's best and only chance to break the cycle of never ending corruption by showing people what has gone down over these past 50 years. The Fifis, the powerful families are combating him daily on all fronts to make him their Maduro or Morales, but it appears he has the upper hand in convincing the people that he is far from that.

Will this happen in Bolivia? Not for another 100 years.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
bennett123
Posts: 9184
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: Unrest in Bolivia

Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:35 pm

He needs more than a Social Media account.

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