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ThePointblank
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 05, 2021 10:25 pm

They are streaming the high altitude test for SN 15 right now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9eoubnO-pE

Edit: And looks like a good landing!

Edit 2: And there's a small fire on the pad that now appears to be out...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPNvB5ComFw
 
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flyingturtle
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 05, 2021 10:42 pm

Another change: They put a camera inside the trailing edge of the forward starboard flamp.

And it seems Nomadd can't scavenge any Starship hardware anymore... :hissyfit:
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
GDB
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 05, 2021 11:13 pm

Nailed it! De tanking ongoing.
60th anniversary of Al Shepard's flight, 21st of Space X being founded.

Shame about the loss of pics and that fire was nerve wracking but it looks like they've done it.
And the brass at NASA are likely feeling vindicated, help see off that HLS challenge.
 
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Nomadd
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 1:34 am

I really need to straighten that camera up.
https://youtu.be/jDEP9jPIJ5Y
 
FGITD
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 2:30 am

Great flight. Really thrilled to see them finally nail the landing.

I’m sure they’re well prepared, but I like to imagine that at least one engineer saw it still standing after landing and thought “Well damn...what do we do with it now?”
 
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ssteve
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 2:56 am

FGITD wrote:
“Well damn...what do we do with it now?”


Monolith on the moon, of course.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 4:00 am

Boy, it barely made the pad...

It seems they kept 2 engines going throughout the landing this time.
Also, that methane leak seems to be rather hard to keep under control...

I wonder if they'll fly it again, or if they'll scrap it and go straight to SN16.
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flyingturtle
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 9:08 am

Francoflier wrote:

I wonder if they'll fly it again, or if they'll scrap it and go straight to SN16.


Maybe a 30 km test... :cloudnine:
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
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flyingturtle
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 12:43 pm

Regarding SpaceX' company culture - an interesting comment on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-jqHFKh70s

"I work at SpaceX and I'll tell you, they are SERIOUS when it comes to process improvements. When you make a mistake most companies will focus their attention on what disciplinary action they should take with you. Here at SpaceX it's the opposite, your punishment is coming up with a solution or system in which that issue can NEVER happen again, to anyone, ever. If you keep showing up late to work they'll literally switch you to a different shift before firing you. It's all about solving problems, not punishment. You have to be a real dirtbag to get fired from SpaceX. Before you apply make sure you are ready to commit to the company entirely. Pretend you're joining the military. It's pretty much like that in many ways..."

Wow.
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
CRJockey
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 12:45 pm

texl1649 wrote:

Naturally, the Chinese have plans for a copy cat as well, with plausible military implications.


I would really hope, that at least in one of the best & civil threads we would spare ourselves such politics. There aren't a dozen different ways of building rockets and other highly on basic physics dependable machines. So what must happen that you wouldn't consider the Chinese copying?
 
CRJockey
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 12:50 pm

ThePointblank wrote:
They are streaming the high altitude test for SN 15 right now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9eoubnO-pE

Edit: And looks like a good landing!

Edit 2: And there's a small fire on the pad that now appears to be out...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPNvB5ComFw


Beautiful job done. Congrats SpaceX and congrats to the people involved.
 
FGITD
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 2:21 pm

flyingturtle wrote:
Regarding SpaceX' company culture - an interesting comment on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-jqHFKh70s

"I work at SpaceX and I'll tell you, they are SERIOUS when it comes to process improvements. When you make a mistake most companies will focus their attention on what disciplinary action they should take with you. Here at SpaceX it's the opposite, your punishment is coming up with a solution or system in which that issue can NEVER happen again, to anyone, ever. If you keep showing up late to work they'll literally switch you to a different shift before firing you. It's all about solving problems, not punishment. You have to be a real dirtbag to get fired from SpaceX. Before you apply make sure you are ready to commit to the company entirely. Pretend you're joining the military. It's pretty much like that in many ways..."

Wow.


Can’t say I’m surprised by that. I actually knew a few people who worked there, and they all say it’s a very demanding place to work but also incredibly rewarding when things go right. But they burn out quickly. I suppose that’s nothing new. If you listen to interviews with Apollo era flight controllers and employees involved in building the spacecraft etc, quite a few will say that they sacrificed their entire personal lives to get to the moon. Even the astronauts themselves had difficulties. Some say that’s why NASA somewhat lost direction after Apollo, too many of the young employees got burnt out and left.
 
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casinterest
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 2:44 pm

I wonder how much damage SN15 took on that landing. It still looked like it came in hard, and leaked for awhile with the methane after words.

It will be interesting to see what the plan is.

Check for damage and take it back to the Assembly building to repair?
Perhaps swap some HW out to other builds?
Or just try to repair and fly it higher?
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
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casinterest
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 3:40 pm

Looks like they are bringing in Tankzilla.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2sgT7O6_LE
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
texl1649
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 5:31 pm

CRJockey wrote:
texl1649 wrote:

Naturally, the Chinese have plans for a copy cat as well, with plausible military implications.


I would really hope, that at least in one of the best & civil threads we would spare ourselves such politics. There aren't a dozen different ways of building rockets and other highly on basic physics dependable machines. So what must happen that you wouldn't consider the Chinese copying?


I didn’t bring up anything political, thanks though. If this doesn’t imply some sort of espionage/copy cat design, I am not sure that there is one in aviation history (from the ars technica article I linked but you did not choose to quote);

The concept is notable not only for its appearance to Starship—the vehicle's exterior is shiny, like the stainless steel structure of Starship, and the first and second stages are similarly seamless—but in its function as well. Although Starship has primarily been promoted as a vehicle to take humans to the Moon and Mars, SpaceX has also developed a point-to-point concept.

SpaceX first unveiled this "Earth to Earth" concept in September 2017. A video released at the time showed a suborbital flight time on Starship from New York City to Shanghai of just 39 minutes and advertised the capability of "anywhere on Earth in less than an hour."

The second point-to-point concept in the Chinese video showed a horizontal takeoff, horizontal landing vehicle that used some sort of electromagnetic catapult.

Both of these systems are part of China's previously announced plans to develop global point-to-point transportation by 2045. Under the country's long-term planning goals, Chinese industry would begin delivering cargo around the globe via suborbital flight by 2035 and passengers by 2045.

This would not be the first time that the Chinese space program has drawn inspiration from SpaceX. The country tracked SpaceX from the very beginning, particularly with an interest in SpaceX's plans to reuse rocket first stages. During the company's very first launch in 2006, as reported in the book Liftoff, a Chinese spy boat was in the small patch of ocean where the Falcon 1 rocket's first stage was due to reenter.

More recently, in 2019, the Chinese Long March 2C rocket tested "grid fins" like those used by the first stage of the Falcon 9 rocket to steer itself through the atmosphere during the reentry process. China intends to develop the Long March 8 rocket to land on a sea platform like the Falcon 9 booster did, and semi-private Chinese firms such as LinkSpace and Galactic Energy appear to be mimicking SpaceX launch technology.


Another source;

https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/04/c ... point.html

https://youtu.be/mzNhrUQ_Qls
 
CRJockey
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 06, 2021 11:33 pm

texl1649 wrote:
CRJockey wrote:
texl1649 wrote:

Naturally, the Chinese have plans for a copy cat as well, with plausible military implications.


I would really hope, that at least in one of the best & civil threads we would spare ourselves such politics. There aren't a dozen different ways of building rockets and other highly on basic physics dependable machines. So what must happen that you wouldn't consider the Chinese copying?


I didn’t bring up anything political, thanks though. If this doesn’t imply some sort of espionage/copy cat design, I am not sure that there is one in aviation history (from the ars technica article I linked but you did not choose to quote);

The concept is notable not only for its appearance to Starship—the vehicle's exterior is shiny, like the stainless steel structure of Starship, and the first and second stages are similarly seamless—but in its function as well. Although Starship has primarily been promoted as a vehicle to take humans to the Moon and Mars, SpaceX has also developed a point-to-point concept.

SpaceX first unveiled this "Earth to Earth" concept in September 2017. A video released at the time showed a suborbital flight time on Starship from New York City to Shanghai of just 39 minutes and advertised the capability of "anywhere on Earth in less than an hour."

The second point-to-point concept in the Chinese video showed a horizontal takeoff, horizontal landing vehicle that used some sort of electromagnetic catapult.

Both of these systems are part of China's previously announced plans to develop global point-to-point transportation by 2045. Under the country's long-term planning goals, Chinese industry would begin delivering cargo around the globe via suborbital flight by 2035 and passengers by 2045.

This would not be the first time that the Chinese space program has drawn inspiration from SpaceX. The country tracked SpaceX from the very beginning, particularly with an interest in SpaceX's plans to reuse rocket first stages. During the company's very first launch in 2006, as reported in the book Liftoff, a Chinese spy boat was in the small patch of ocean where the Falcon 1 rocket's first stage was due to reenter.

More recently, in 2019, the Chinese Long March 2C rocket tested "grid fins" like those used by the first stage of the Falcon 9 rocket to steer itself through the atmosphere during the reentry process. China intends to develop the Long March 8 rocket to land on a sea platform like the Falcon 9 booster did, and semi-private Chinese firms such as LinkSpace and Galactic Energy appear to be mimicking SpaceX launch technology.


Another source;

https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/04/c ... point.html

https://youtu.be/mzNhrUQ_Qls


Shiny appearance? Fins? Shocking development. What’s next? Using rocket motors as well?
 
FGITD
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 7:27 pm

Musk tweeted that they may try to re-fly sn15 again soon.

Given the eventual goal of using these on a regular basis, I can understand it. And it's definitely one way of determining how the vehicle held up. I guess we'll find out if it blows up on the pad
 
zanl188
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Sun May 09, 2021 12:11 pm

And we have a Falcon 9 first stage with a record 10 launches under it’s belt….


https://youtu.be/J71s2KmkSrc

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WIederling
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Sun May 09, 2021 1:56 pm

flyingturtle wrote:
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/space-junk-sleuths-track-down-the-rocket-chunks-that-lit-up-the-northwests-skies-last-month/

About a guy who hunted for the Falcon 9 upper stage debris when it landed in the northwestern United States... interesting stuff.

(Partially relephant song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEJ9HrZq7Ro - "Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down? - It's not my department, says Wernher von Braun")


if it is China or Russia the printpresses and bitbuckets go overtime:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1460625
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FGITD
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Sun May 09, 2021 7:43 pm

WIederling wrote:
flyingturtle wrote:
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/space-junk-sleuths-track-down-the-rocket-chunks-that-lit-up-the-northwests-skies-last-month/

About a guy who hunted for the Falcon 9 upper stage debris when it landed in the northwestern United States... interesting stuff.

(Partially relephant song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEJ9HrZq7Ro - "Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down? - It's not my department, says Wernher von Braun")


if it is China or Russia the printpresses and bitbuckets go overtime:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1460625



Significant difference between having an issue lead to an unplanned re-entry, and the incident with the Chinese rocket.

China launches with no regard for where it’ll come down.

There’s also the little detail of the Chinese rocket being about 10x larger than the SpaceX piece.
 
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casinterest
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Tue May 11, 2021 5:12 pm

FGITD wrote:
Musk tweeted that they may try to re-fly sn15 again soon.

Given the eventual goal of using these on a regular basis, I can understand it. And it's definitely one way of determining how the vehicle held up. I guess we'll find out if it blows up on the pad



They are currently lifting it back to the launch platform

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms47Krkaz24

It will be interesting to see if there was any damage to the engines or structure. The legs looked a bit compromised when I saw the close up

I imagine the pressurization test and then fuel loading test will be critical.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Tue May 11, 2021 11:50 pm

The 'landing' legs will have to be replaced at a minimum. :P Unless they want to use the rest of the crush cores.
 
meecrob
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 13, 2021 3:59 pm

As "wussy" as those landing legs are, they still did the job! You can see the initial impact point and also where the ship came to rest so they too a hell of a beating. I wonder what they weigh? Maybe 20 kilos each?
 
ThePointblank
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 13, 2021 11:58 pm

SpaceX has filed an FCC application for a Starship orbital flight, and the application contains some interesting info about the mission profile for the flight:

https://apps.fcc.gov/els/GetAtt.html?id=273481&x=

Basically, the booster will land somewhere offshore in the Gulf of Mexico, and Starship will land somewhere north-east of Hawaii.
 
FGITD
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Fri May 14, 2021 3:47 am

SpaceX finally posted the “official” highlights video

https://youtu.be/7CZTLogln34

That landing video is incredible. Even more impressive is that the vehicle almost looks like it’s still at a very slight angle right up into the last second, then goes vertical and touches down.

That orbital test looks like it’ll be a hell of a show. Particularly since it seems like all the components will end up destroyed one way or another. Hope it goes to plan and we get some good of a starship water touchdown
 
zanl188
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Sat May 15, 2021 9:42 pm

A very dirty, almost dark grey, Falcon 9 is sitting on Pad 39A at the moment getting ready to loft another batch of Starlink sats in about an hour.

Hopefully the Electron failure this morning does not rub off on Falcon 9.
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zanl188
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Sat May 15, 2021 11:07 pm

And Falcon 9 1st stage has landed successfully on the drone ship. 6th landing for this booster.
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flyingturtle
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Tue May 18, 2021 1:06 pm

In between adjusting various crypto currencies and building an impressive collection of cranes in Boca Chica (two crawlers cranes for the full stack are currently being assembled), SpaceX is working towards an extended permit:

The facility in Boca Chica was approved when SpaceX still had F9 and FH in mind. Using the place for the much more powerful Starship booster needs an environmental re-assessment by the FAA. Though the FCC document gives June 20th as the earliest date for a Starship + Booster launch, the FAA has not scheduled any deadline for the public commentary.

https://spacenews.com/spacex-outlines-f ... st-flight/

https://www.faa.gov/space/stakeholder_e ... ship/faqs/
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Francoflier
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 4:07 am

Does anyone know what the plan is for stacking Starship on top of the booster is for the test flight since the integration tower won't be ready yet?
I don't think even those massive cranes are tall enough...
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flyingturtle
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 12:53 pm

Francoflier wrote:
Does anyone know what the plan is for stacking Starship on top of the booster is for the test flight since the integration tower won't be ready yet?
I don't think even those massive cranes are tall enough...


They are tall enough. They can be extended. Most of the Liebherr cranes can be extended. An example is this video of an LR 1500 https://youtu.be/Kez8qyBWHEw?t=555 .

With the SDB2 equipment, the LR 11350 which operates for SpaceX can lift 70 metric tons if the load is at a height of 150 meters and a whopping 132 meters away from the rotational center of the crane. Technical sheets are easily findable.

The LR 13000 can lift loads to 236 meters.
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Nomadd
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 3:13 pm

It would probably take two cranes for the lift unless the tower is partially operational. They need to secure the top of the booster while attaching the Starship. Windless days are rare out there, so it won't be easy.
Not sure if guy lines are an option. Or brackets to the partial tower. The next two sections are ready to lift and would make the tower just about tall enough for that.
 
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Tugger
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed May 26, 2021 7:10 pm

Am watching the 100 successful launch for SpeaceX. At T+3:33 you see things spinning to the left far below the booster as it reorients to its landing trajectory. I first thought it was the fairings but I don't think so now. Anyone with what they are?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRu-ekesDyY

Tugg
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Francoflier
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu May 27, 2021 7:52 am

It could be a piece of insulating fabric, or maybe a piece of ice that got dislodged.

What I found spectacular was the mach shockwave that was clearly visible at around T+1:00 as it went supersonic.
I’ve never seen it that clearly before, and I suspect the humid Floridian air did help making it that conspicuous.
I though the whole thing was RUD-ing for a second…

On a side note, SpaceX needs to vary the commentary on these launch feeds a bit. I swear they repeat the exact same things every single time.
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Nomadd
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Fri May 28, 2021 5:00 am

Tugger wrote:
Am watching the 100 successful launch for SpeaceX. At T+3:33 you see things spinning to the left far below the booster as it reorients to its landing trajectory. I first thought it was the fairings but I don't think so now. Anyone with what they are?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRu-ekesDyY

Tugg

CGI artifact.
 
ThePointblank
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:39 pm

Looks like the USAF is starting to sniff around Starship, this time to deliver cargo point to point around the world in hours:

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/06 ... -starship/

As part of last week's federal budget rollout, a process during which the White House proposes funding levels for fiscal year 2022, the US Air Force released its "justification book" to compare its current request to past budget data. The 462-page book contains a lot of information about how the Air Force spends its approximately $200 billion budget.

For those tracking the development of SpaceX's ambitious Starship vehicle, there is an interesting tidbit tucked away on page 305, under the heading of "Rocket Cargo" (see .pdf). The Air Force plans to invest $47.9 million into this project in the coming fiscal year, which begins October 1.

"The Department of the Air Force seeks to leverage the current multi-billion dollar commercial investment to develop the largest rockets ever, and with full reusability to develop and test the capability to leverage a commercial rocket to deliver AF cargo anywhere on the Earth in less than one hour, with a 100-ton capacity," the document states.

Although this does not refer to Starship by name, this is the only vehicle under development in the world with this kind of capability. The Air Force does not intend to invest directly into the vehicle's development, the document says. However, it proposes to fund science and technology needed to interface with the Starship vehicle so that the Air Force might leverage its capabilities.


I can see why the USAF is interested; being able to deliver 100 tons of cargo to anywhere in the world in mere hours is going to greatly appeal to the military in being able to rapidly respond to situations globally.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 4:12 am

Definitely something the military would be interested in. How cool would it be to have a fleet of Starships in USAF (USSF?) markings...

But before getting carried away, among the many major technological and engineering hurdles that concept would have to clear, the obvious one to me is that after you've shipped a couple of missile launchers across the planet in your Starship... How do you send it back?

Provided you even have the ability to refuel a rocket with tons of methane and cryogenically cooled O2 wherever your theater of operations is, can a booster-less Starship make it back the other way with no payload?
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ThePointblank
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 8:41 am

Francoflier wrote:
Definitely something the military would be interested in. How cool would it be to have a fleet of Starships in USAF (USSF?) markings...

But before getting carried away, among the many major technological and engineering hurdles that concept would have to clear, the obvious one to me is that after you've shipped a couple of missile launchers across the planet in your Starship... How do you send it back?

Provided you even have the ability to refuel a rocket with tons of methane and cryogenically cooled O2 wherever your theater of operations is, can a booster-less Starship make it back the other way with no payload?

There's a note in the article about the potential for air dropping the cargo after reentry, and I suspect that an emptied Starship won't need a booster to send back, or to another point where it can be mated to a booster to send back stateside.
 
mxaxai
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 9:57 am

ThePointblank wrote:
I can see why the USAF is interested; being able to deliver 100 tons of cargo to anywhere in the world in mere hours is going to greatly appeal to the military in being able to rapidly respond to situations globally.

Not hours, minutes. You could deliver a C-5 worth of cargo and troops to any point on Earth within less than 45 minutes. Need an MBT for fire support right now? No worries, it'll arrive on your location in 20 minutes (give or take). You could also launch all US nuclear warheads with just a few Starships. Or you could create nuclear stockpiles on the moon. The possibilities are endless.

I suppose reusability might be difficult but if you release the payload on a parachute and glide to a nearby refueling point, it could be possible. Though a Starship would be a great target for any air defense system.
 
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ssteve
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 5:32 pm

And if troops go along, why of course they'll be Starship Troopers.
 
CRJockey
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 6:45 pm

ssteve wrote:
And if troops go along, why of course they'll be Starship Troopers.


beauty of a movie...
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 9:26 pm

Starship alone can do sub orbital hops without SuperHeavy. You'll only need SuperHeavy if you want to get to orbit.
 
tommy1808
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 10:48 am

mxaxai wrote:
ThePointblank wrote:
I can see why the USAF is interested; being able to deliver 100 tons of cargo to anywhere in the world in mere hours is going to greatly appeal to the military in being able to rapidly respond to situations globally.

Not hours, minutes. You could deliver a C-5 worth of cargo and troops to any point on Earth within less than 45 minutes. Need an MBT for fire support right now? No worries, it'll arrive on your location in 20 minutes (give or take).


Hours, several of them. You need to fuel first.

You could also launch all US nuclear warheads with just a few Starships.


If all your targets happen to be along some very few straight lines.

. Or you could create nuclear stockpiles on the moon..


Which would be useless and in violation of international law.

Though a Starship would be a great target for any air defense system.


Even for a rifle.
Starship will be awesome to get stuff into orbit or to the moon, but all the interplanetary and point to point stuff is pure scam.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
texl1649
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:13 am

I think the sole military application for starship would actually not be logistics, but for a quick reaction force of armed drones. They could be air delivered (starship could be disposed of after releasing them somewhere up high at a near standstill), in a Mogadishu (black hawk down), or Benghazi situation where a small unit/force is being over-run, and create a substantial impact/provide cover/communications/options.
 
mxaxai
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:34 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
Hours, several of them. You need to fuel first.
...
Which would be useless and in violation of international law.

Thomas

You could keep some rockets fueled and ready to go. The US had B-52s flying circles in case they were needed immediately.

International law is cared about only if it's mutually beneficial. If you think you're stronger or can deal with the fallout, any laws are worth as much as the paper they're printed on.

From a purely technical POV, Starship creates many new options to transport cargo. Whether they make sense regarding politics and cost is another question.
 
tommy1808
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 1:54 pm

mxaxai wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
Hours, several of them. You need to fuel first.
...
Which would be useless and in violation of international law.

Thomas

You could keep some rockets fueled and ready to go. The US had B-52s flying circles in case they were needed immediately.


And those B52's used cryogenic slush fuel? Not going to happen.

If you think you're stronger or can deal with the fallout, any laws are worth as much as the paper they're printed on.


Well, if you base nukes on the moon everyone is just going to assume you had to much bleach in your drink, since they will invariably nuke you days before your munitions arrive.

From a purely technical POV, Starship creates many new options to transport cargo.


It creates exactly one new option for transporting cargo, and one that is particularly simple to shot down on top of that.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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bikerthai
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 2:56 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
It creates exactly one new option for transporting cargo, and one that is particularly simple to shot down on top of that.


More simple than a charter 747? Note that the reentry profile is high speed up high and almost vertical bellow. Less time traveling over enemy territory.

Wonder if the Virgin rocket can do intercontinental? That would seem to be an easier concept to implement.

bt
Intelligent seeks knowledge. Enlightened seeks wisdom.
 
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SamYeager2016
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 3:31 pm

CRJockey wrote:
ssteve wrote:
And if troops go along, why of course they'll be Starship Troopers.


beauty of a movie...

With all due respect, the book's marvellous, the movie rather less so IMO.
 
tommy1808
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:38 pm

bikerthai wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
It creates exactly one new option for transporting cargo, and one that is particularly simple to shot down on top of that.


More simple than a charter 747?


Almost certainly. And probably slower under most circumstances.

SamYeager2016 wrote:
CRJockey wrote:
ssteve wrote:
And if troops go along, why of course they'll be Starship Troopers.


beauty of a movie...

With all due respect, the book's marvellous, the movie rather less so IMO.


I'd say book and movie are so vastly different that they both can be very good on their own.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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flyingturtle
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Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2011 1:39 pm

Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:38 pm

Whew! Continuous video feed from the first stage, until landing on OCISLY!
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
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Stitch
Posts: 27643
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Re: SpaceX - Tests, Launches, Developments - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 7:02 pm

Yeah that was awesome to see "Of Course I Still Love You" during the final descent and then actual touchdown on the pad.
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