Perhaps Wilco737 can clear this up !
Looking at the picture of the crew rest area on the upper deck of the new 8F there are only two seats shown on the left side of the upper deck cabin with a bulkhead immediately in front of and behind them.
Has the actual usable space inside this upper deck been reduced this much and if so, what is behind the bulkhead ?
The older freighters with the classic hump had far more space available, very curious.
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747 8F Question
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
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RE: 747 8F Question
I believe the 747-8F has the same upper deck as the 747-400F (and earlier 747Fs) so it might just be a customer configuration decision.
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting Stitch (Reply 1): I believe the 747-8F has the same upper deck as the 747-400F (and earlier 747Fs) so it might just be a customer configuration decision. |
I am sure it is, I just wondered what they have done with the space behind that rear bulkhead.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
GGg
RE: 747 8F Question
Get in a few more tall pallets. Beneath the upper deck, you are limited to 96 inch tall pallets. The further back the upper deck extends, the further aft this restriction extends.
Proud OOTSK member
RE: 747 8F Question
The upper deck on the -400F is indeed smaller than on the classics.
While I don't know what photo you are looking at, for all the -400 freigthers I've flown, right behind the cabin seats would be the bulk head door that leads to the bunks. Most typically there are 4 beds, double stacked.
While I don't know what photo you are looking at, for all the -400 freigthers I've flown, right behind the cabin seats would be the bulk head door that leads to the bunks. Most typically there are 4 beds, double stacked.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4): While I don't know what photo you are looking at... |
Photo © Alberto Sanarlitano
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting Max Q (Thread starter): Has the actual usable space inside this upper deck been reduced this much and if so, what is behind the bulkhead ? |
It's not as bad as you think...look at the lower left corner of the picture in Reply 5. That's a door hinge...that door opens up into a multi-bunk space behind that bulkhead.
Also, if you stand in the position this photo was taken and turn 180 degrees, the fwd bulkhead is much farther forward...the seating area on the right side is much larger than on the left. The forward left side is the galley.
Tom.
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting Max Q (Thread starter): Perhaps Wilco737 can clear this up ! |
Not really no. No access to the 748F. I guess there will be some beds somewhere on the upper deck for proper sleep during long flights and enlarged crew.
wilco737
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4): While I don't know what photo you are looking at, for all the -400 freigthers I've flown, right behind the cabin seats would be the bulk head door that leads to the bunks. Most typically there are 4 beds, double stacked. |
Ok, that's different to the set up I have seen with -400 pax versions that have a 2 up bunk set up just behind and to the left of the cockpit.
This area is separate and in front of the rest of the upper deck.
| Quoting lowrider (Reply 3): Get in a few more tall pallets. Beneath the upper deck, you are limited to 96 inch tall pallets. The further back the upper deck extends, the further aft this restriction extends. |
That makes a lot of sense, is that really the case ?
| Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 6): It's not as bad as you think...look at the lower left corner of the picture in Reply 5. That's a door hinge...that door opens up into a multi-bunk space behind that bulkhead. Also, if you stand in the position this photo was taken and turn 180 degrees, the fwd bulkhead is much farther forward...the seating area on the right side is much larger than on the left. The forward left side is the galley. |
Understand, would like to see a picture taken from that aspect.
Overall though, it is surprising how much smaller this upper deck space is compared to the classic (freighter or pax version)
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
GGg
RE: 747 8F Question
The only difference between the -400F & the -8F is the galley and toilet, they are changed slightly, the seating and bunk arrangement in the "cabin" are the same. The pic above is the same as the -400Fs I've flown.
Obviously a BCF is vastly different.
Obviously a BCF is vastly different.
Enthusiast
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting Max Q (Reply 8): That makes a lot of sense, is that really the case ? |
Yes, there's a lower height restriction under the upper deck. This is why you can load higher cargo through the side door than you can through the nose door.
| Quoting Max Q (Reply 8): Understand, would like to see a picture taken from that aspect. |
I tried to find one, no luck so far. I'll keep looking.
| Quoting Max Q (Reply 8): Overall though, it is surprising how much smaller this upper deck space is compared to the classic (freighter or pax version) |
If you mean this particular spot on the upper deck, I defer to those with more -400F experience. The overall area of the upper deck is no different on the -400F and the -8F.
Tom.
RE: 747 8F Question
| Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 10): If you mean this particular spot on the upper deck, I defer to those with more -400F experience. The overall area of the upper deck is no different on the -400F and the -8F. |
What I meant was, the usable crew space in the upper deck even with the bunks behind the bulkhead is far less than the older -200 freighter upper deck.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
GGg
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- 747classic
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RE: 747 8F Question
On the 747-200F and -200SF the 10 ft. main deck pallet capability was available aft of station 903.
On later produced 747-200F and the 747-400F the inside of the short hump was modified to accept one more row of 10 ft main deck pallets. (until station 777).
Conseq : On early 747-200F, all 747-200SF and -200C (in full cargo configuration) aircraft, the available upper deck space was (slightly) larger then on the last produced 747-200F and all -400F aircraft.
AFAIK the available upperdeck space is identical at the 747-400F and the 747-8F.
Earlier (larger) upper deck configurations :
Later (smaller) upper deck configuration (747-200F -747-400F
[Edited 2011-12-02 04:59:02]
On later produced 747-200F and the 747-400F the inside of the short hump was modified to accept one more row of 10 ft main deck pallets. (until station 777).
Conseq : On early 747-200F, all 747-200SF and -200C (in full cargo configuration) aircraft, the available upper deck space was (slightly) larger then on the last produced 747-200F and all -400F aircraft.
AFAIK the available upperdeck space is identical at the 747-400F and the 747-8F.
 |
| 747-200F/400F - 10 ft pallet capability |
Earlier (larger) upper deck configurations :
 Photo © Vasco Garcia |  Photo © Joe Corrigan |
Later (smaller) upper deck configuration (747-200F -747-400F
 Photo © Vasco Garcia |  Photo © Jonathan Rankin |
[Edited 2011-12-02 04:59:02]
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
RE: 747 8F Question
Thanks 747Classic for your usual informed input.
And the pictures are worth a thousand words!
And the pictures are worth a thousand words!
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
GGg
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RE: 747 8F Question
Here are some pictures from the main cargo deck of an Atlas Air 747-200SF and a 747-400F aircraft.
On the LH picture (747-200SF, looking aft) visible the barrier strap at station 903 (just aft of the green ceiling structure), prohibiting loading cargo over 8 ft high, fwd of this position.
On the RH picture (747-400F, looking aft) clearly visible the same barrier strap but now more FWD, at station 777.
Note : At the 747-400F also at the 10 ft high, aft part of the main-deck full fire protecting lining has been installed, necessary by new regulations.
And now the 747-8F: as shown at the next picture of a new Cathay freighter , the barrier stap is also located at station 777, so the available upperdeck floor surface must be identical on the 747-400F and the 747-8F.
But each customer can of course select a different internal upperdeck lay-out.
View Large View Medium
Photo © Christian Junker
[Edited 2011-12-03 02:36:10]
On the LH picture (747-200SF, looking aft) visible the barrier strap at station 903 (just aft of the green ceiling structure), prohibiting loading cargo over 8 ft high, fwd of this position.
On the RH picture (747-400F, looking aft) clearly visible the same barrier strap but now more FWD, at station 777.
Note : At the 747-400F also at the 10 ft high, aft part of the main-deck full fire protecting lining has been installed, necessary by new regulations.
 Photo © Wojtek Werpachowski |  Photo © Craig Murray |
And now the 747-8F: as shown at the next picture of a new Cathay freighter , the barrier stap is also located at station 777, so the available upperdeck floor surface must be identical on the 747-400F and the 747-8F.
But each customer can of course select a different internal upperdeck lay-out.
Photo © Christian Junker
[Edited 2011-12-03 02:36:10]
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
RE: 747 8F Question
This is the 747-400F upper deck floor plan and the -8f is nearly identical from what I can tell. Ask me again at this time next year and I'll give you a definite answer.
This is the 747-400 BCF floor plan:
This is the 747-400 BCF floor plan:
RE: 747 8F Question
Thanks Kaus, but where are the crew bunks on the -400 ?
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
GGg
GGg
RE: 747 8F Question
The blue shaded areas indicate crew rest in both diagrams; the bunks are stacked on the BCF and head to head on the -400F (there is a wall separating them at the head).
RE: 747 8F Question
Just in case, one may consider to take a look on to 360-panorama of AirBridge Cargo's 744F upper deck (supernumerary area): http://airbridgecargo.com/boeing747tour/index3.html
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